+1

When a Brooks saddle is broken in you can see the sit-bone indentations. It's these "custom-made" divots that make the saddle comfortable. The more upright you are, the more weight on your sit-bones, and the more this comes into play.

Personally I (age:59) do also ride on Selle Italia, for a couple hours of faster local riding. Touring days of 7 hours in the saddle would not work for me, in that aero position. I like the added benefit, in that an upright position allows me to see more of my surroundings.

Several folks have mentioned the rain issue. Obviously, one wouldn't leave the saddle in the rain without a cover. But what about riding all day in a steady drizzle. We all know it's not unusual. Clearly the bulk of the seat top is covered (some people provide more coverage than others :)) but surely the saddle still gets wet. What has your experience been with rainy day rides and their impact on the saddle?

Good points.

I will add to that though... I don't know your age, but being over 60 does not necessarily factor into the choice. I am 61 and have had no desire to move my bars higher. FWIW, I like my road bike, touring bike, and MTB bars all at pretty much the same height. Also I find my preferred low bar height more important for comfort on long all day rides and day after day riding.

I purchased my B17 a few weeks before my first century and never had an issue with it up to that point. My second century was the day after my first and it rained the entire time and I had brought nothing to protect it. The leather got soaked and became a hammock that I had to endure for several hours. The good news is that once it dried out and I adjusted it for the stretch, it was perfectly broken in with less than a month on it. I do NOT suggest this method though as the last 60 miles on day 2 was pure hell

Brooks do not “have to be broken in” They feel fine right out of the box, and just get better as the form to your bottom.

Springs are for people who sit more upright. For others, the natural spring in the leather saddle is a nice cushioning.

My butt can not tell the difference from the Stainless Steel rivets and the copper ones. My eyes can tell the difference. If you are in more of a racing position (handlebars several cm below seat), some of the narrower more racing sized saddles may be a better option.

I’ve never ridden the brooks in the rain (or left it in the rain), but that to me would be the biggest handicap (although the swift did come with a rain cover).

(FYI, I have a std B17, and a narrower swift with copper rivets)

I will agree that the B17 break in period is less heinous than some suggest...in fact sometimes I wish the leather was a little bit thicker because they get too saggy too soon and the skirts begin to flare out- enter the B17 Select. The leather on the Select is hella thicker than the B17 Standard or the B17 Special. Haven't ridden one but I'm thinkin' that after it's broken in (which WILL take some time) it may conform better to the rider's anatomy rather than just becoming a hammock. There are more non-Brooks options now too. Rivet Cycle Works and Berthoud make some outstanding, comfortable saddles.

You don't like relatively inexpensive, comfortable things?

No problem. Actually, it's good to go for a ride on a rainy day during the first few days you have the saddle ... it'll make the saddle even more comfortable. :)

Otherwise mudguards and the usual plastic grocery bag tucked into the rails will help.


I've ridden my Brooks a lot, and in some pretty wild weather ... and they have been fine.

Or, as the bikesnob so eloquently put it:

People ride Brooks saddles in Portland, where we get 37.5 inches of rainfall per year, which really isn't so much especially in the Pacific Northwest except that it comes in the form often of not downpours but several days in a row of on-again/off-again drizzle. We get that 37.5 inches on average spread out over an average of 154.5 days. In contrast, SF gets 23.63 days of rain over about 73 days. We have over twice as many days with measurable (greater than or equal to a hundredth of an inch) precipitation, but not twice as many inches of rain.

Most shops here that carry Brooks Saddles also carry these shower-cap looking things made out of material similar to a windbreaker/raincoat that you can slip over the saddle. They seem to work. I don't hear of many Brooks users trashing their saddles here if they exercise just a minimal amount of care.


I have had my B135 for about three weeks now and it's been just fine. The legendary butt-breaking break-in period seems absent, but then maybe my LBS did a good job helping me match the saddle to the rider and then attaching the saddle to the bike.

I have a 30 year old brooks Pro.. Proofided thoroughly by melting the waxes,
in the stuff [warm oven, saddle upside-down]


on long tours in the wet , i left a couple plastic bags on it, 24/7.

but I commute on a composite saddle, for now..
Selle Italia Turbo, and Fizik Vitesse.
[I got the Vitesse, batch made for Brompton , replaced a B17
to get the setback I could not get out of the other saddle..
on the seatpost the bike came with.. ]

Hi!
I wanted to share my experience with Brooks.
I chose Brooks Champion Flyer for my touring bike and my wife chose Aged Flyer for hers and have never looked back. I can speak for both of them, since my wife allowed me to borrow hers for a small (6 days, 1000km) trip while mine wasn't yet arrived. The seat was completely new when I took it out and it was comfortable straight out of the box. Every day I rode more than 100km and last day of the trip was 240km and I didn't even have to think about the saddle - that's how comfortable it was. The same thing with my Champion Flyer - it has been comfortable from the day 1. The terrible "breaking in" period could be related to incorrect saddle fitting...
I cant speak for my wife, but i chose the Flyer over the b-17, because the springs do add a bit more comfort. they take away all those little bumps but the big ones - well, they aren't more comfortable with unsprung either ;) some mention that they are heavy, but those few hundred grams aren't that much. you will carry a lot more when touring and the weight of those springs won't make any difference.
Although these saddles share the same shaped top, same rails and springs, there are few differences. each has its own pros and cons:

Flyer Aged:
+ better looking (personal preference)
+ no need for proofide before using
+ has laces that help the saddle to keep its shape
- a bit softer leather than the regular flyer. that could mean shorter lifetime.
- the Brooks backplate is worse looking than the one on regular brooks seats. besides this one doesn't look aged compared to the standard - it looks more modern which ruins the whole "aged" feel of the saddle.

Champion Flyer:
+ has tough leather and seems like it will last longer than the aged one
+ better looking backplate
- the saddle is slippery
- Its noisy (yeah, proofide and oil on metal/metal and metal/leather contacts might help, but for me it didn't take away all the squeaking and creaking. only helped to reduce the sound a bit)
- has no laces to help to keep its shape (you can always drill some yourself though...)

All the cons are really tiny compared to the comfort and good emotions that these saddles can provide. besides, almost every con i mentioned can be "fixed" with a DIY modification.

About the rain - it's no problem as long as you take care of the saddle. the problems start if it gets soaked and then proofide is applied (on wet saddle) or if its wet and later left in really hot direct sunlight or even worse - dried with hairdryer. You should leave it to dry naturally.

Jerry Seinfeld's thoughts on Leather:

Obviously he didn't know about Proofide.

I'm prolly not qualified to comment, but I've now got approx 7,700 miles on by Brooks Flier(sprung) and have found NO reason to replace it with anything else...

BTW. Most of my miles have been accumulated whilst pulling a BoB trailer behind a flat-bar road bike in the Southwest of the U.S.

This post is useless without pics!:thumb:

Just bought a BoB off of CL a couple months ago....haven't even had a chance to use it yet.....too hot and too busy.....still 100 degrees every day here in DFW....:cry:

I bought a B17 for my LHT. It was comfortable on first ride, but a little slippery with padded shorts. After a couple of long rides, it felt pretty good, and a slight seat adjustment (raising the nose up a notch) has made it perfect. I don't think about my saddle while I'm on it, and it's been good on 100+ mile rides.

Quite frankly, though, I got it because it was leather, looked good, and had a good reputation. I know some people that just hate them, and you really need to let your bottom decide.

As far as the spring model, it seems like that would be more a comfort bike feature than a tourer. But if you like it, go for it.

Don't we all? Sadly, I'd rate the Brooks B17 I rode for 200-300 miles as the second-worst saddle I've ever owned. Painful from Day #1 and stayed that way. The only saving grace was the generous return policy of Wall Bike...

It is not a problem. Cover the saddle when leaving it outside in the rain, but I have ridden my brooks saddles uncovered in all weathers including truly torrential downpours with no ill effects

Me too.

I really do wonder if it depends.on the individual seat- I have one I wouldn't ride in rain uncovered, but the other one is much much stiffer and is prob thicker leather, so could get away with it....

I have 6+ leather saddles and they all get used the same way. They range from a 35+ year old Wrights to a brand new Brooks B67, I also have a couple of Ideales. They all get the same treatment and none seem to have suffered. The old Wrights has been used on a road bike, trials bike, tour bike and a mountain bike. It is nearing the end of it's useful life, but I don't consider that too bad for a saddle that I bought out of the second hand bin at a bike shop in the late 1970s. I don't doubt there are differences in the various leather covers due to variances in the leather, cows are funny that way.

Aaron :)

You lost me, I'm 57, owned a bike shop, toured in my teens and twenties then raced in my 20's. Tried an Ideale, Brooks and others over periods of time. Found modern saddles to work better for me.

After commuting some 6000 miles my plastic saddle gave out. Up on my wall was my old touring bike from the 70's a Dawes Supper Galaxy and on it was my old Brooks B17. Cleaned up the B17 rubbed in the oil for a couple of days, installed it on my commuter and have put a couple hundred miles commuting with no discomfort. If there was discomfort when I first bought it I do not remember because it was some 30+ years ago. I’m more than pleased with my old saddle.

I switched to a Brooks saddle about seven years ago, and have been more than happy with it. It felt fine right away; there was no break in period to speak of.

I keep a shower cap in the outer pocket of my pannier. When it starts to rain, I cover the saddle with the shower cap, and so far no problems. The saddle has, on occasion, gotten quite wet, but it has always dried out on its own.

I don't think I did anything to the saddle for the first four or five years I owned it. But when the leather was dry looking, I slathered it, top and bottom, with some kind of boot goop. I repeated this a few months ago.

I read recently that the B17 has been in continuous production longer than any other bicycle accessory -- more than 100 years, since 1896!

I'm just wondering what kind of shorts everyone else is using with their B17's. I, normally, use hiking shorts with nylon travel underwear with pretty good results, but on a short tour I did last week I got talked into using my padded bike shorts- which had been sitting in a drawer ever since I bought my first Brooks saddle a few years ago. Anyway, I don't know if it was the amount of time I spent on my bike due to a route change (10-12 hours a day), or the steep hills that I ended walking up with my fully loaded bike to get to my new destination, but I ended with a couple of huge saddle soars that I've never had before.

So, padded, unpadded, Lycra, or other shorts- what's your preference?

Jon

I still prefer padded bike shorts, but go with what works for you.
As for your sore issue, too many variables for strangers to advise more than what works for us individualy.