I decide not to camp illegally here in the States. I don't want a ticket or perhaps even jail time with a fire and an open bottle. Public Intox is a night in jail.

Luckily, here in Iowa, it is very legal to set up camp for up to 14 days (have to move footprint after 14 days) along any meandered river and something like within 200 or 300 yards within the high water mark. Can even drink adult beverages legally as long as camp is set up. Must bring a shovel though because fire must be in a hole unless it's on a sand bar.

So I'm very fortunate to live just a couple miles away from the Des Moines River valley where it's heavily and dense wooded to camp primitive and legally.

It's actually sort of sad. The wildlife in the town, which can include mountain goats, is totally habituated to humans. These three paid me no mind as they grazed on the lawn of the town's municipal building. There were two more just outside the frame of the photo:

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=411787

The night before I saw a mom and a fawn that looked no more than a week or so old come out of the bushes by the liquor store.

I agree, especially in British Columbia Canada. I've camped out in the woods a great deal and other than taking precautions
with my food against bears, and porcupines and rodents against chewing my gear, I've never had any serious critter problems. The only situation that kept me awake very long was a large pack of wolves holding choir practice a couple hundred yards from me for what seemed like at least an hour.

That'd be enough to make a guy take up religion!:lol:

Last summer there were 10 cougar sightings within the city limits of our small town.

That incident was in the Cascades while riding the Alcan Hwy. The wolves being nearby didn't really
bother me as I've been around wolves many times in the outback. It was their very loud and long
howling that rose from low to high and then higher only to start again and again when I thought they
were through. This went on for a long time. I tried to make ear plugs out of toilet paper but it didn't
shut it out enough for me to get back to sleep.

I dog and one bear, the bear is going to be confident. But one dog without a pack is probably wondering why he has to do all the work while humans snap photos. More than a few dogs, pile of trouble for a bear.

As far as camping in Southern Ontario (where I live) is concerned, you are trespassing even when it isn't marked. The law includes such stuff as fencing, crops, etc... as indicators that the land is protected against trespass. In the south, you will encounter a lot of that kind of land.


What you seem to be referring to is stealth camping, not wild camping. Wild camping is camping in places like a wilderness, or undeveloped at least. Most of southern ontario is more rural.

Some of the best places to stealth camp are in towns, they are full of areas most people are scared to venture into at night, and nobody claims as their own. Valleys where houses aren't able to be built, bush lots, places were houses are being built, golf courses (in the bush around them), etc... Just take your sleeping bag and gear, out at night, and set up camp in as many places where you live, and see how it goes. Think micro environments, you don't need a thousand acres, you need 100 square, feet, not even.

You are obviously doing what is legal and works in your area. That said, open fires haven't really been acceptable in camping for like 40 years. While alcohol is being consumed, sounds a bit like drinking and driving. There was an earlier time when firemaking and lean to type depredations of the countryside were accepted. They have been widely rejected for decades, though they are now back through "bushcraft". Of course they are a survival necessity or harmless in some areas, just not many.

Yes, you're correct on the term, I couldn't remember "stealth" when I composed the post and I thought that "wild" was close enough, perhaps not.

If you are starting in Sudbury Wild is probably what you will face. Along the Saint Lawrence and the lakes, it would be a combo of things, I guess, I did that route a few times, the lakes one. I'm only picking you up on the point because that may be helpful in your situation with other boards, or whatever. Myself, I find the fragmentation of camping styles and all the arguments around them a little annoying, though I pitch in. :)

I suppose one other thing is that ideally when stealth camping, one should always pretend one is wild camping. So if I pick a wild looking scrap, I would be all innocence that I was trespassing if ever challenged. Of course the whole point of stealth camping is that they will never know you were there. By the way, it isn't lying, it is normally pretty much impossible to know who owns what, or what rules cover it on a long bike tour. So I just subscribe to my side of the argument.

The biggest problem with stealth camping is that the behaviour required interferes with the camping process. Like you cycle till you can barely see the surroundings then you get into your camp, no shower, campfire, cooking, etc... Then you wake up at dawn, no washing no rest room, and you take off again. You are not going to be discovered, even in enemy territory, ask the SAS, but you just don't have the kind of dream situation you have when wild camping, etc...

In ontario, one of the better forms of cycle touring is on roads in the bush, or snowmobile trails. Definitely the best tours I have had here was on those kinds of roads. You can wild camp or fish wherever you want. You see lots of animals, often at close range. If you google ontario trails, you will find a comprehensive list, and discover most of them are snowmobile trails, some nearly 900 km long, or longer. Unfortunately they are often impassable, generally, or in places, so you have to do your homework.

Some snowmobile trails are only passable if there is sufficient snowfall to cover the roughness of the ground underneath. There also are many quad trails near my camp/cottage, some of which become snowmobile trails in the winter. I've been on a couple of these and in some cases, they really need a motor more powerful than my body to use and a machine more capable in muddy or loose conditions. Maybe my experience is skewed by the small amount of trails I've been on, maybe more of them are passable but I think it would be a bit of a risk in that I might get to a point that I need to turn around.

I'm not looking for that much adventure while bike touring. :lol:

True, but there are many snowmobile/quad trails that are converted rail trails and I've found those to be very passable by bike. If you'd like an account of a two day trip on the K&P Trail between Renfrew and Kingston see here: https://sites.google.com/site/twodaysonthekickandpush/

I saw your blog but didn't have time to read it, I'll have to do that. I remember that you were going to Algonquin but I didn't realize that there were any Rail-to-Trails in Ontario, I thought that the K&P Trail was in the US on your way, not in Ontario.

I found this map of the trail. It is now called the Kick and Push Trail but it follows the rail bed of what was intended to be the Kingston to Pembroke line (both K&P).

Map: Pop-Up Maps - www.NiagaraRails.com - kingpem.gif

I have camped in Southern Ontario for many years and the best experiences are the accidental ones. Small town people seem to be the most open about letting you camp on their property just for the asking and sometimes a free meal with great conversation. No charge.

I find them by plotting a destination in Google maps and then hitting the bicycling icon. Their database appears to be pretty well tied into the Rails-to-Trails Conservancy's list. This summer's ride from Sault Ste. Marie to Kingston involved some rail trail riding. Here is a section that I did this summer described in the opposite direction than the one I took: Lindsay to Peterborough (I think the description is a bit old. The trestle crossing he describes between Omemee and Peterborough is well protected with high railings).

Though it doesn't state it on that particular website you can connect with another rail trail that takes you from Peterborough to Hastings. If you look at Google Maps it shows a continuation of that trail to Campbellford and Stirling and beyond. The access for ATV/quadrunners is blocked until Hastings. After that they share the trail and it is roughened up considerably.

From the Sault to Kingston? You may have passed by us, in Sudbury, unless you went south across Manitoulin Island.

Thanks for the info!!

Manitoulin Is. it was, and from there the Bruce Penn., Owen Sound, Meaford, Collingwood, Orillia, Lindsay, Omemee, Peterborough, Hastings, Campbellford, Stirling, etc. (Much of which was on rail trails)

Once, long ago, on a journey north to canoe on the Albany River I did go through Sudbury.

No offense intended to Sudburyites, but Manitoulin Island and the Bruce Penninsula were probably the highlight of the trip (which actually started in Duluth and included the U.P. of MI before getting to the Soo).

No offense taken, in fact, I agree!!

If you're biking in the area again, give me a PM and maybe we can ride together for a couple of days.

You should try it up here in the Northeast. Big pine forests, open fields, nice ponds to swim in. Barbed wire, chiggers and wild dogs? Nope. Not everywhere is backfilled swampland. :)

When I've wild camped in the western US, I could usually take advantage of picnic areas with potable water to cook dinner and clean up the dishes, body, and laundry before heading out into more wild areas to set up a camp out of sight of the road. I'd try and ride below the sweat level to keep the clothes fresh. Then pack up in the AM and ride to some nice place to either cook or buy breakfast--I'd also have some danish and fruit just in case it would be some distance to a "nice place".

I was stealth camping in Michigan when I was woken by walking all around my hammock, and then some crazy noises. Finally decided it was deer moving around. Then they seemed to party for another two hours yelling and what seemed like making circles around me. In the morning, I climbed out of the hammock. Not twenty feet away, two deer jumped up and took off. Don't know which of us was more startled.

My brother and I spent a night just outside the mowed area of the Point Reyes N.S. visitor's center (Bear Valley) picnic area (we just hung around 'til closing time and then laid out our sleeping bags in the trees along the margins of the p.a. ignoring any "no camping or overnight parking" signs we might have chanced to see). Not fearing any rain, but more in the way of a view shield, I pitched a black tarp between us and the main traffic area (also I think it might have given us shade from any parking lot lights). Sometime past midnight we were both awakened by the sounds of Donner, Dancer and Blitzen and a hundred of their fallow deer friends. I swear one jumped over our tarp. It was a bit unnerving. It hasn't scared me off of stealth camping however.

I have ridden up the Northern Peninsula of Michigan over Sault St. Marie and into Canada where we hit the Mantoulin Islands. I remember the stretch of RT 17 to be fairly populated all the way to Espanola with many fishing camps and Bed and Breakfasts. We caught a deal from a place that had a fishing party cancel late in the day. I remember the land to have a lot of water. Great lakes on one side and lots of stream, ponds, and marshes on the other.

I usually try to camp free and find that the best way to approach it is to start looking early and then get in and out quickly. If I have an opportunity I will always ask politely making sure to let them know I will be on my way in the morning, no fires, and nothing left behind. I had one farmer who let me camp in his glorious field and his dog spent the night with me.

I find that the biggest danger is dogs. Not that they will attack you instead that they will know you are 500 yds. away and they will bark all night. I try to find spots far away from anything.