Race_experience 101?
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Race_experience 101?
I'm hoping that the power of the collective can help me fast-track some 'race-experience', through input from all of you lovely folk.
Ive been selected for a squad that is going to attend some big races in a couple of month's time. Although i've been riding bicycles all my life, I've been riding and racing on the track for only a year, and so my 'race-experience' is sadly lacking.
Fortunately i am working with a coach, so my many aspects of my riding itself are benefiting, but race experience is something you can only get racing.... or reading about it!
(well, not the same benefit, but certainly a benefit). I've found the race report thread to be very useful as its helped me to think about different aspects of racing that had not yet naturally occurred to me. sadly, that thread is a little dry at the moment 
So, at risk of asking people to give away their guarded secrets, i'd really value any race-strategy tips at all that anyone is willing to share.
i'm an endurance rider, and will be riding scratch, points and individual pursuit, at these races.
My current strategy in the scratch is very basic - stay near to the front, so that i can respond to moves if necessary, but not so near that i have to work too much; go with attacks; burn all the matches at the bell.
I'm not too good at working out where i should position myself in the last few laps? (high and near the front [more work] high and mid pack [more people to come around?]
My strategy in the points has been non-existent, other than to again sit near the front and burn a match for each sprint. Last points race i was in, i was in the points for every sprint except the last two, but low in the points, with others coming over me at the line - which suggests to me that i'm going too early? not sure. any tips? a mate of mine's strategy is to stay with the sprints but not going all out, for the first 2, and then attack when the rest are tired - but i guess it depends on your strengths.
also, what clues to you guys look for in picking a 'safe' wheel, but one that isn't a dud?
what clues suggest an attack is a good one to go with, or one to leave the bunch to real in?
I know i'm asking a lot here, but will really value any input at all, thanks :-)
Ive been selected for a squad that is going to attend some big races in a couple of month's time. Although i've been riding bicycles all my life, I've been riding and racing on the track for only a year, and so my 'race-experience' is sadly lacking.
Fortunately i am working with a coach, so my many aspects of my riding itself are benefiting, but race experience is something you can only get racing.... or reading about it!


So, at risk of asking people to give away their guarded secrets, i'd really value any race-strategy tips at all that anyone is willing to share.
i'm an endurance rider, and will be riding scratch, points and individual pursuit, at these races.
My current strategy in the scratch is very basic - stay near to the front, so that i can respond to moves if necessary, but not so near that i have to work too much; go with attacks; burn all the matches at the bell.
I'm not too good at working out where i should position myself in the last few laps? (high and near the front [more work] high and mid pack [more people to come around?]
My strategy in the points has been non-existent, other than to again sit near the front and burn a match for each sprint. Last points race i was in, i was in the points for every sprint except the last two, but low in the points, with others coming over me at the line - which suggests to me that i'm going too early? not sure. any tips? a mate of mine's strategy is to stay with the sprints but not going all out, for the first 2, and then attack when the rest are tired - but i guess it depends on your strengths.
also, what clues to you guys look for in picking a 'safe' wheel, but one that isn't a dud?
what clues suggest an attack is a good one to go with, or one to leave the bunch to real in?
I know i'm asking a lot here, but will really value any input at all, thanks :-)
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Oh dear, have i asked the un-askable and mentioned the un-mentionable??
oo boy.... two months to go (til world masters!!) - very excited to be going, very slim on the experience. Any tips for riding on board, and for possible race strategies (the tips given to the young lady racing on grass were great) at all? i've only ridden concrete tracks; 250m and 330m, ~42 deg.
oo boy.... two months to go (til world masters!!) - very excited to be going, very slim on the experience. Any tips for riding on board, and for possible race strategies (the tips given to the young lady racing on grass were great) at all? i've only ridden concrete tracks; 250m and 330m, ~42 deg.

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The difference between wood and concrete, while quite noticeable, is not significant (other than the need to keep minimum speed to prevent sliding down on wood). The much more significant difference between tracks is the banking and tightness of the turns. Going from a relatively flat 333m to a steep 250m or 167m takes some getting used to. Even that isn't a big deal, and since you already have experience at those differences, you're in good shape.
Reading about it certainly helps, but a lot gets lost in translation, and you are right, this is an area that requires experience. This is true for anything of course, but I've found it far more true of track racing than any other type of bike racing I've done (road, crit, mtb, cx). There are not only more types of races, but also everything is more condensed/pressurized. For instance, even for the most basic race (Scratch), virtually every lap is intense and requires your full strategic attention. Now multiply that for the other types of omnium races. I've done about 100 individual mass start races in the past year... and every one has unfolded very differently, so each one has been a learning experience. And I still make mistakes in every race.
At this early juncture, I'll just say that it is probably worth spending most of your strategic bandwidth assessing the field. I can't think of a single instance where I've had a "general strategy" that held up. Oh, and unless you have your field completely outclassed, I wouldn't suggest burning a match for "each sprint."
i'm an endurance rider, and will be riding scratch, points and individual pursuit, at these races.
My current strategy in the scratch is very basic...
My strategy in the points has been non-existent, other than to again sit near the front and burn a match for each sprint.
My current strategy in the scratch is very basic...
My strategy in the points has been non-existent, other than to again sit near the front and burn a match for each sprint.
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A wise man once said the points race was a blue collar job. You're better off getting points in every sprint than going all out, winning one, then getting blown out the back.
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I was taught that you can be dumb and be a good points racer, but you have to be the smartest person on the track to be a great points racer.
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I was conversing with my teammate (Steve Carrell, masters world champ in the points race) about a race once. At any point in the race he knows the point tally of every racer in contention as well as determine how many points he needed (and that he needed to deny them) to win. I was amazed at how much thinking goes on in the race.
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The difference between wood and concrete, while quite noticeable, is not significant (other than the need to keep minimum speed to prevent sliding down on wood). The much more significant difference between tracks is the banking and tightness of the turns. Going from a relatively flat 333m to a steep 250m or 167m takes some getting used to. Even that isn't a big deal, and since you already have experience at those differences, you're in good shape.
Reading about it certainly helps, but a lot gets lost in translation, and you are right, this is an area that requires experience. This is true for anything of course, but I've found it far more true of track racing than any other type of bike racing I've done (road, crit, mtb, cx). There are not only more types of races, but also everything is more condensed/pressurized. For instance, even for the most basic race (Scratch), virtually every lap is intense and requires your full strategic attention. Now multiply that for the other types of omnium races. I've done about 100 individual mass start races in the past year... and every one has unfolded very differently, so each one has been a learning experience. And I still make mistakes in every race.
At this early juncture, I'll just say that it is probably worth spending most of your strategic bandwidth assessing the field. I can't think of a single instance where I've had a "general strategy" that held up. Oh, and unless you have your field completely outclassed, I wouldn't suggest burning a match for "each sprint."
#8
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#9
aka mattio
+1
I was conversing with my teammate (Steve Carrell, masters world champ in the points race) about a race once. At any point in the race he knows the point tally of every racer in contention as well as determine how many points he needed (and that he needed to deny them) to win. I was amazed at how much thinking goes on in the race.
I was conversing with my teammate (Steve Carrell, masters world champ in the points race) about a race once. At any point in the race he knows the point tally of every racer in contention as well as determine how many points he needed (and that he needed to deny them) to win. I was amazed at how much thinking goes on in the race.
I can podium a cat 1/2 points race reliably, but can't win the ****er.
Possibly because at the end, when I'm breathing through my eyeballs, I have no ****ing clue what's going on.
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Yeah, I'd venture to guess that once you can figure out this mental gymnastics, that will have you "working smarter, not harder". One of the best local (and former national) level racers that I know is known for his ability to choose his battles wisely. He won't contest the first 2 or 3 sprints in a race. He lets the newbie enduros and knucklehead sprinters battle those out and kill themselves. Then he picks up points as he goes through the rest of the sprints. You'll see him attack at the right times and finish off the youngsters after they have already put one foot in the grave beating up on each other.
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Yeah, I'd venture to guess that once you can figure out this mental gymnastics, that will have you "working smarter, not harder". One of the best local (and former national) level racers that I know is known for his ability to choose his battles wisely. He won't contest the first 2 or 3 sprints in a race. He lets the newbie enduros and knucklehead sprinters battle those out and kill themselves. Then he picks up points as he goes through the rest of the sprints. You'll see him attack at the right times and finish off the youngsters after they have already put one foot in the grave beating up on each other.
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Points races are a good place to be mean too. On Thursday a bunch of us saw that one strong rider was in a really large gear. So the first few sprints were controlled in a way that forced a lot of hard short accelerations, all in an effort to burn him out early. It worked moderately well.
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Points races are a good place to be mean too. On Thursday a bunch of us saw that one strong rider was in a really large gear. So the first few sprints were controlled in a way that forced a lot of hard short accelerations, all in an effort to burn him out early. It worked moderately well.
#14
aka mattio
Yeah. "Madisons are won in the second half of the race" often applies to points races, too, but a lot depends on your competition.
Here's a bit of race wisdom: the winning move goes off after the hardest chase of the race (ie, attack when it's hard for everybody).
Here's a bit of race wisdom: the winning move goes off after the hardest chase of the race (ie, attack when it's hard for everybody).
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It was definitely worth my while being off line for a week. thanks for all the input, everyone.
