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Old 02-02-17, 12:00 AM
  #4001  
taras0000
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Those are paint jobs. Plasti-Dip looks like crap after a while.
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Old 02-02-17, 06:49 AM
  #4002  
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Fluid Trainer is "Stiff"

I have a Performance Ascent fluid-trainer for my 2008 Sirrus (I'm new so I can't post a URL so you'll have to look it up...)

The problem I'm having is it is "Stiff" - its the only word I can think of. The roller doesn't roll freely, so when the wheel is against it and I'm pedaling, it only rolls with the revolution of the crank - then it slows to a stop - imagine pushing a treadmill with the strength of your legs (obviously this is different, but....similar). So my question is - am I doing something wrong? I know that I have it set up correctly, but I wonder if the trainer is malfunctioning, needs lubrication (if so...how?) etc.

Please help!!

N
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Old 02-02-17, 08:17 AM
  #4003  
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The roller on a trainer shouldn't roll freely. It's connected to the resistance unit (fluid in you case) at all times. Trainers don't allow for much coasting at all.

Have you ridden another trainer before? Or do you have someone with experience who could try yours? It sounds about right to me, but it's possible there is something wrong. Hard to say without trying it.
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Old 02-02-17, 09:23 AM
  #4004  
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Originally Posted by carbonjunkie View Post
Once I'm off the naughty list I can post a pic of the Fuji

I cut the seat mast and swapped out the saddle with a Fizik and love the ride. Took it for a spin through the neighborhood tonight. I think i might strip the frame down and shoot some Plastidip on it. Maybe a matte black or even all white! I've seen a couple of Track Pro's in all black and they look pretty cool. Not sure if it's a full paint job or just Plastidip.
Whelp...now you are into spending the time, energy, and money on the frame that I suggested that you don't do.

To be honest, I think you will be better off with a basic steel frame with an appropriate geometry than spending time, energy, and money on this one.

The materials don't matter as much as one might think. Changing frame materials solves problems, e.g.: You are 225lbs and really strong and you flex a normal steel frame, so switching (not upgrading) to aluminum or carbon will provide a flex-free platform.

But, if you aren't flexing the steel, then there are no net gains...just net losses in your wallet

That's a simple example, but that's the gist of my point.
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Old 02-02-17, 09:43 AM
  #4005  
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No worries. The Plastidip would be just for fun and the cost of a couple of cans wouldn't break the bank.

I'm pretty happy with the bike as it sits and don't plan on doing much to it. However, tweaking and changing things as we get stronger or faster is what we do, right? If i'm not changing things on my road bikes then I don't feel like I'm getting better.

Ironically, I am 230lbs. and have a power lifting background. My challenge is to not break stuff on my bikes. I've had steel and scandium frames and they get pretty mushy. Based on my initial rides on this alloy frame (sounds cooler than aluminum) I'm pretty happy with the power transfer.

Maybe some day I could have a custom steel frame made that can handle the load
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Old 02-02-17, 10:53 AM
  #4006  
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Originally Posted by carleton View Post
OK.

You are doing the thing where you ask for advice, you get it, then explain why you shouldn't listen to the advice.

It's cool. But, it seems that that's what's happening.
My original question was how you would measure the seat height on a track bike. Since bottom bracket height and crank arm lengths typically vary a little more than on road bikes I just wondered if there was a secret way of doing things. I mentioned that I was going to cut the seat post and we had a good discussion about how to build spacers to possibly make minor adjustments. I definitely took that advice as valuable and have in fact made some spacers if needed for future adjustments.

I never asked for advice on the bike I bought or whether I should spend time or money on modifying the components. You brought up the resale value of the components not me. I was just having a friendly conversation about track bikes. I'm not sure what advice I'm not listening to? This thing took a turn when someone had concern about the durability of the carbon crankset that came on the Track Pro. The version that I have does not have an issue so I'm good with that.

I certainly value your opinion and hope I can glean from your experience and expertise in the future. Please let me know if you have a different view. I don't want to be known as one of those guys
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Old 02-06-17, 09:29 PM
  #4007  
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Originally Posted by carbonjunkie View Post
My original question was how you would measure the seat height on a track bike. Since bottom bracket height and crank arm lengths typically vary a little more than on road bikes I just wondered if there was a secret way of doing things.
I don't know if anyone ever answered the original question and it seems like you've got it figured out, but you would want to measure from the pedal spindle to get the same leg extension as on your road bike and then go from there. Or go from bottom bracket spindle and add 2.5 mm(or however much shorter the track cranks are) Of course, if you found yourself getting more serious into track racing, you might look into matching the crank lengths on your bikes. 9/10 of my bikes have 172.5 cranks on them now.

I've known some guys to run their saddles slightly lower on their track bikes vs their road bikes to help smooth themselves out at higher cadences though, and by lower, I mean millimeters difference.

Another thing to note, if you find yourself interested in any of the timed events that allow aero bars, saddle height may change again. I find myself sitting further forward on my saddle when on aero bars and it requires me raising my saddle a few mm to compensate for the difference.
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Old 02-07-17, 01:38 PM
  #4008  
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That's good info blackbullet. I followed your example by adding the 2.5 mm and got pretty close. I've done some high rpms on the rollers and it feels pretty good but I need to get on the track to get this dialed in. I'm sure I'll be moving things around as I learn more about the track.

I run 172.5mm cranks on my road bikes and I feel like I have a little more power available with the longer cranks. I've read that the shorter cranks keep you from scraping the pedal on the track but I can't imagine it would make that much difference. I would prefer 172.5 if others run that length. The track in Frisco is 44 degrees so would it vary by track?
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Old 02-07-17, 01:40 PM
  #4009  
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FWIW (I'm fat, slow, haven't ridden on the track in a couple years, etc) I run 172.5 on the road and 167.5 on the track. Partly for higher rpm, partly because that's what people said is done, and partly for the extra clearance in the corners for low speed tactics.

I raced in Rock Hill, which was 44.5* I believe. Now I'll be at T-Town, which is not nearly as steep, so I'm not sure if people tend to longer cranks or still stay short for RPM.
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Old 02-07-17, 02:33 PM
  #4010  
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Rules of thumb from road to track should be avoided. Remember the one about, "The TT on your track bike should be 2cm shorter than the TT on your road bike...period." or "All track bikes should use 165mm cranks...period."? People really believed that.

Crank length also depends on your events and riding style. There is no rule of thumb that will be perfect for everyone. The demands of a team sprint, flying 200, match sprint, kilo, 3K, and 4K are different.

Even in local racing, there are specialists and generalists. If you are going to be a specialist, choose your components that supports the events in which you will specialize.

This is a sport where winning and losing (even at the local level) is often decided within a couple of seconds or less. These things matter.
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Old 02-07-17, 04:57 PM
  #4011  
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Originally Posted by carbonjunkie View Post
That's good info blackbullet. I followed your example by adding the 2.5 mm and got pretty close. I've done some high rpms on the rollers and it feels pretty good but I need to get on the track to get this dialed in. I'm sure I'll be moving things around as I learn more about the track.

I run 172.5mm cranks on my road bikes and I feel like I have a little more power available with the longer cranks. I've read that the shorter cranks keep you from scraping the pedal on the track but I can't imagine it would make that much difference. I would prefer 172.5 if others run that length. The track in Frisco is 44 degrees so would it vary by track?
Your pedals will be more of a limiting factor than the crank length itself, and also remember to team that up with your BB height. I run 175mm cranks and can do low speed on an indoor board track without contact ~ 42 banking.

On the road you are kind of restricted gearing wise with compact and standard cranksets and set cassette combinations. On the track you can virtually have any combination you want. With that in mind you need to consider your gain ratio. What that does is takes into account all your gearing, including your crank length. So all things being equal, a 100" gear using 165mm cranks will equate to a 106" gear using 175mm cranks due to the 6% difference in crank length and therefore leverage.

On the track you will find that you have a sweet spot cadence range for whatever event you do. That will depend on you, your crank length and the event's demands. Play around with gearing to get a feel for it. Go high, go low and go everywhere you can in between and see what results.
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Old 02-07-17, 05:02 PM
  #4012  
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Originally Posted by carbonjunkie View Post
That's good info blackbullet. I followed your example by adding the 2.5 mm and got pretty close. I've done some high rpms on the rollers and it feels pretty good but I need to get on the track to get this dialed in. I'm sure I'll be moving things around as I learn more about the track.

I run 172.5mm cranks on my road bikes and I feel like I have a little more power available with the longer cranks. I've read that the shorter cranks keep you from scraping the pedal on the track but I can't imagine it would make that much difference. I would prefer 172.5 if others run that length. The track in Frisco is 44 degrees so would it vary by track?
While you do get more clearance for pedal strike with shorter cranks, on a proper track frame it shouldn't ever really be a problem. I haven't had any clearance issues at Rock Hill, SC (42.5*) or Blaine, MN (43*).

172.5 is on the longer side of what most people run, but I'm 6'4" and it's what feels good to me. I'd say go ahead and give the 170mm cranks a try and see how you like them over time. Maybe even try something shorter and then settle on whatever you like best.
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Old 02-07-17, 09:34 PM
  #4013  
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Don't forget to factor in BB height/drop. This measurement can vary by 1cm between popular make/models of track frames. 2cm if you count Serenity bikes which had an unusually high BB (which is probably why people said it felt different to ride).
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Old 02-08-17, 10:18 PM
  #4014  
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The BTs have a 2cm difference in BB drop between the Sprint and Enduro bikes. 45mm for sprint, 65mm for enduro. These tend to be on the higher end of BB drop. Many "all-rounder" or sprint oriented track bikes have 55-60mm BB drops. Dedicated pursuit bikes can be around 75mm.
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Old 02-09-17, 07:56 PM
  #4015  
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Searching for recommendations for a cycle computer. I'd like this thing to be as basic (and cheap) as possible. I have few requirements:
-The only functions I really need are current and maximum speed
-Wireless (will have to remove it for racing)
-Want to mount sensor on the rear wheel and head unit on bar/stem (rear wheel mount for data while training on erg)

Any recommendations? Thanks in advance
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Old 02-10-17, 03:04 AM
  #4016  
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Garmin Edge 25? You can get a bundle with a speed sensor for the rear wheel pretty cheap ($200 ish in Aus) I'm not sure about cat eye computers being able to upload stuff, and the price is normally pretty close to garmins by the time you get to the better ones. I can never concentrate on the screen during full gas efforts, so being able to pull the data off and view it in Ostrava or whatever is what floats my boat.
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Old 02-10-17, 06:45 AM
  #4017  
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Thanks Minion1, but I'm talking MUCH simpler. I literally need only current and maximum speed, I don't need to download anything- I'm the guy who still keeps a training log in a paper notebook!
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Old 02-10-17, 07:19 AM
  #4018  
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Originally Posted by Baby Puke View Post
Thanks Minion1, but I'm talking MUCH simpler. I literally need only current and maximum speed, I don't need to download anything- I'm the guy who still keeps a training log in a paper notebook!
I've used a Cat Eye Urban - about $20 and wireless, with a mount that can work on the bar or stem.
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Old 02-10-17, 10:34 AM
  #4019  
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Originally Posted by Baby Puke View Post
Searching for recommendations for a cycle computer. I'd like this thing to be as basic (and cheap) as possible. I have few requirements:
-The only functions I really need are current and maximum speed
-Wireless (will have to remove it for racing)
-Want to mount sensor on the rear wheel and head unit on bar/stem (rear wheel mount for data while training on erg)

Any recommendations? Thanks in advance
I think the Cateye Strada CC-RD310W might be what you are looking for. I used it when I first started racing in 2009. I've seen tweets from elite racers using them. Make sure it's CC-RD310W as all "Strada" models are not the same. Some have a fork-only sensor. I believe this sensor will work on fork or chain stay. On the chain stay, just tilt it inwards toward the wheel. The down-side is that you will have to move your magnet based on your chainring/cog combination.



https://www.amazon.com/CatEye-CC-RD3...dp/B00JXN78IM/

Street price is around $40 or less. You might find them at most well-equipped bike shops.

Unsolicited advice: Maybe spring for a system that records cadence as speed and distance on an ergo don't mean anything because you are not fighting air resistance. Cadence does. I'd imagine your ergo workouts would be centered around time and cadence as opposed to time and speed or time and distance.
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Old 02-11-17, 03:37 AM
  #4020  
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Thanks guys. Based on this and some cyber-snooping I've just ordered a Cateye micro, should do the trick. And Carleton, yeah, these workouts are based on cadence, and thanks to your excellent track apps for iPhone (*shameless plug*) I'll just use speed and gear to give me cadence rather than pop for the more complicated computer with a cadence sensor.
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Old 02-11-17, 10:12 AM
  #4021  
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Originally Posted by baby puke View Post
thanks guys. Based on this and some cyber-snooping i've just ordered a cateye micro, should do the trick. And carleton, yeah, these workouts are based on cadence, and thanks to your excellent track apps for iphone (*shameless plug*) i'll just use speed and gear to give me cadence rather than pop for the more complicated computer with a cadence sensor.
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Old 02-11-17, 10:16 AM
  #4022  
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Originally Posted by bigfred View Post
Any reason not to get sram omnium cranks on a track bike?
Sugino DD's Also Some Frames Can't Fit Omiums And People End Up Denting The Chainstay It's Best To Find Out If Your Frame Is Compatible Before Buying
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Old 02-11-17, 10:20 AM
  #4023  
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Originally Posted by naltimar View Post
I have a Performance Ascent fluid-trainer for my 2008 Sirrus (I'm new so I can't post a URL so you'll have to look it up...)

The problem I'm having is it is "Stiff" - its the only word I can think of. The roller doesn't roll freely, so when the wheel is against it and I'm pedaling, it only rolls with the revolution of the crank - then it slows to a stop - imagine pushing a treadmill with the strength of your legs (obviously this is different, but....similar). So my question is - am I doing something wrong? I know that I have it set up correctly, but I wonder if the trainer is malfunctioning, needs lubrication (if so...how?) etc.

Please help!!

N
Ditch The Trainer Buy Rollers Trainers Are Noisy That's Why They Are Not Popular Among Track Cyclists Tire Wears Too Quickly On Trainers
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Old 02-11-17, 10:53 PM
  #4024  
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Sweet, if it's mostly indoors stuff you should be ok - I do top cadence efforts on the trainer once a week or so, and I've got no chance of focussing on the screen to know and remember my cadence. I also wear glasses, and sweat like a pig, so I've got no chance of seeing anything 90% of the time.
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Old 02-28-17, 05:10 PM
  #4025  
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Quick question about the world cup: How do trade teams qualify? I assumed it was an event for countries, but it seems like 2 of the riders in the women's sprint in Cali were from a Russian trade team which had entered alongside the Russian national team.
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