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Old 10-23-17, 09:22 AM
  #1326  
JimiMimni
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Originally Posted by carleton View Post
And Hoogland is abnormally big. Probably one the largest active track sprinters right now:


It is infinitely amusing to me to call professional athletes "abnormally big." I know what you mean, but it is still hilarious.
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Old 10-23-17, 09:37 AM
  #1327  
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Originally Posted by JimiMimni View Post


It is infinitely amusing to me to call professional athletes "abnormally big." I know what you mean, but it is still hilarious.
Hahaha, but I mean, he's bigger than his peer pro athletes on top of that!
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Old 10-24-17, 12:31 PM
  #1328  
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This an interesting article I read a while back, especially in light of a recent discussion we had about mavic comete/io vs. Zipp wheels: Relentless Pursuit of Cycling Aerodynamics ? Part 3. Track Bike Aero Test. - Fit Werx
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Old 10-24-17, 12:37 PM
  #1329  
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Originally Posted by rustymongrel View Post
This an interesting article I read a while back, especially in light of a recent discussion we had about mavic comete/io vs. Zipp wheels: Relentless Pursuit of Cycling Aerodynamics ? Part 3. Track Bike Aero Test. - Fit Werx
I think you can find it at WeightWeenies forum a story from the ex-Zipp engineer about some practical tests of Zipp808. Zipp tried to takeover Aussie track front wheels and Alberto Contandor HED GT3. Very interesting stories, including placebo effects etc. I don't have a link now but it's really worth to look for it!

EDIT: Found it! http://forum.slowtwitch.com/forum/Sl...ics)_P5988702/

There is also some explanation about which wheel is the fastest one

Last edited by bartek.; 10-24-17 at 12:50 PM.
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Old 10-24-17, 02:01 PM
  #1330  
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Yes that was what I posted a month or so ago when we were debating the merits of various wheels. I thought it was interesting to see some third party testing showing similar results.
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Old 10-24-17, 05:04 PM
  #1331  
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The London Six has started, and is livestreamed!


A buddy of mine is riding the u23 races - too bad those aren't streamed too!
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Old 10-25-17, 11:03 AM
  #1332  
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I think fork wheel interaction is still not fully understood or tested. I recall seeing somewhere that the fastest fork ever tested was a flat bladed high tensile fork off of an old Schwinn? with massive clearance. Perhaps using one of these on an Io would actually make the io faster than an 808.
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Old 10-25-17, 02:47 PM
  #1333  
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Originally Posted by tobukog View Post
I think fork wheel interaction is still not fully understood or tested. I recall seeing somewhere that the fastest fork ever tested was a flat bladed high tensile fork off of an old Schwinn? with massive clearance. Perhaps using one of these on an Io would actually make the io faster than an 808.
Yeah, I'm sure you know but for the sake of others, Team GB did that for London.

Here is a pic of their bike (albeit with a front disc):



Look at this, though. Trott was using a normal fork with the IO in a bunch race:



And the flying lap:



But the wide fork in the time trials (can't tell if this is the 500m or IP):



I'm curious as to why Cervelo (or anyone else) didn't continue with that idea.
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Old 10-25-17, 03:11 PM
  #1334  
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Maybe they discovered the gains weren't significant enough to justify the expense.
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Old 10-25-17, 04:33 PM
  #1335  
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I'm watching the London SixDay, and there are a bunch of guys on aluminum bikes - including Ben Thomas, the madison world champion, who is riding a raw frame with labels I can't make out. He's also on the new Look alu frame, the 875 Madison. Won a derny race on day 2 riding it.
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Old 10-25-17, 06:53 PM
  #1336  
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Originally Posted by seau grateau View Post
Maybe they discovered the gains weren't significant enough to justify the expense.
I was told that the forks used by GB team are more likely one-day-only fork because of too much stress for such a tiny amount of material. The cost of producing a single fork was huge enough that most of the national teams simple couldn't afford it (something like ~3-4k EUR per fork). Even GB decided to use them only for the biggest events due to costs. That was around London 2012. Wondering what has changed since that time as 5 years is a lot for technology. I would say production costs should be lower now but they didn't use them for Rio, right?
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Old 10-25-17, 07:15 PM
  #1337  
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Originally Posted by queerpunk View Post
I'm watching the London SixDay, and there are a bunch of guys on aluminum bikes - including Ben Thomas, the madison world champion, who is riding a raw frame with labels I can't make out. He's also on the new Look alu frame, the 875 Madison. Won a derny race on day 2 riding it.
Actually the yellow look 875 that we saw at Euro champ, Six Day london and even Red hook Milan is a carbon frame.

So now the Look track lineup is as following:

R96 for sprinters
875 as the all-around frame for endurance rider with round 31.6mm seatpost and standard 1-1/8'' fork
464 AL as the all-rounder frame in aluminium

Document with the geometry of all Look Frames
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Old 10-25-17, 08:05 PM
  #1338  
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oh, huh! assumed it was a midlevel Alu. thanks for the reminder - now i remember that it's replacing the Look Axman.

but he's also riding a metal frame for the madisons:
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Old 10-25-17, 08:51 PM
  #1339  
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That (guessing) alu frame reminds of T-Red bike because of the top tube/seat tube junction but the dropout is not same. Maybe a custom alu frame ?
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Old 10-25-17, 10:20 PM
  #1340  
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Originally Posted by Poppit View Post
European track champs live timing Veloresults Live Timing
Thanks, BTW, Poppit.

For the bike manufacturers of the world, I'd like it to be noticed that Hoogland rode:

- 09.853" flying 200m. Q: 7th; finished with Silver
- 1:00.700 Kilo for Gold
- 43.405" Team sprint for Bronze

Using a [gasp] ROUND seatpost!!!




(true story)


Be bold, bike manufacturers. If Apple and Google can get rid of the headphone jack, you can get rid of the aero seatpost.
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Old 10-26-17, 06:07 AM
  #1341  
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You got it backwards. The round seatpost is the 3.5mm head phone Jack of the bike world. It's an accepted universal standard that always works and people want it back. It's only been removed to serve the needs of the manufacturers.
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Old 10-26-17, 06:58 AM
  #1342  
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Originally Posted by taras0000 View Post
You got it backwards. The round seatpost is the 3.5mm head phone Jack of the bike world. It's an accepted universal standard that always works and people want it back. It's only been removed to serve the needs of the manufacturers.
Damn. How did I miss that. You are right
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Old 10-26-17, 09:28 AM
  #1343  
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A bit of skinsuit analysis for you, filmed at our Velodrome no less, Is it a disadvantage to wear the Grand Tour leader's skinsuit? (video) - Cycling Weekly
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Old 10-26-17, 12:39 PM
  #1344  
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Originally Posted by Poppit View Post
A bit of skinsuit analysis for you, filmed at our Velodrome no less, Is it a disadvantage to wear the Grand Tour leader's skinsuit? (video) - Cycling Weekly
That's a great article. Even though the point on the test was to test skinsuits on the road, the fact that they used top world-level pursuiters and tested on the track makes it even more relevant for track riders!
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Old 10-26-17, 07:51 PM
  #1345  
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Originally Posted by carleton View Post
That's a great article. Even though the point on the test was to test skinsuits on the road, the fact that they used top world-level pursuiters and tested on the track makes it even more relevant for track riders!
Even better the velotec suit is really cheap and apparently works quite well, I'd been eying one off for a little bit but expected a sub 100 britain dollar suit to be more show than go. Apparently not the case
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Old 10-26-17, 11:22 PM
  #1346  
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Originally Posted by spartanKid View Post
It makes a lot of sense that most "aero" wheels perform very similarly at zero or very, very low yaw angles. It's higher yaw angles and crosswinds that were the reason people departed from the V profile deep wheels in the first place.

If you can find them, I bet those Blackwell Research 100 mm rims test pretty favorably compared to modern wheels at low/head-on yaw angles. I'd bet those would make a decent pseduo-front disc on the track, if they're stiff enough.
Wow. That was my first aero wheel. I didn't know what I had. Looking back, it was a great wheel, and yeah, stiff enough.

This is me riding it in 2009:
Attached Images
File Type: jpg
200M Finish.jpg (78.8 KB, 79 views)
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Old 10-26-17, 11:32 PM
  #1347  
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I just found this gem from 2007 in the road forum when someone was asking about Zipp 808 vs Blacwell 100:

Originally Posted by Waldo View Post
To answer the OP's question, the 808 outperforms the 100 on effective wind angles of 0-25° while the 100 is superior at 25-30°. With typical effective wind angles falling between 10° and 20°, the 808 is generally the better bet. It's a common misconception that depth equals aero. While this would be true were all else equal, a 303 at 38 mm deep actually outperforms v-shaped rims such as the Reynolds and Shimano at 46 and 50 mm deep, respectively. As an engineer at Zipp, you may question how objective I am on the subject; however, this data is available on Analytic Cycling and has been replicated in Tour and l'Achteur Cycliste magazine tests. Look for articles in Inside Triathlon and Road magazines in the coming months, also. Last I saw, they were omitting some of the test results from our last wind tunnel test as they were concerned about offending advertisers.

As an aside, the Blackwell rim is produced out of an open mold in Taiwan and is thus available under a variety of other brand names...if you like that rim one of the other brands may be cheaper for you.
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Old 10-27-17, 02:30 AM
  #1348  
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Originally Posted by pierrej View Post
Even better the velotec suit is really cheap and apparently works quite well, I'd been eying one off for a little bit but expected a sub 100 britain dollar suit to be more show than go. Apparently not the case
I like this. Our club has just switched to velotec for our customised clothing. Looking forward to getting a decent club skinsuit!
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Old 10-27-17, 05:54 AM
  #1349  
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The Velotec skinsuits aren't as good a quality as the premium brands, Bioracer, Endura, etc but they are fast.
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Old 10-27-17, 07:55 AM
  #1350  
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Originally Posted by Godsight View Post
That (guessing) alu frame reminds of T-Red bike because of the top tube/seat tube junction but the dropout is not same. Maybe a custom alu frame ?
MANAIA PISTA | T°RED BIKES - fhtn529.com
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