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Low Carb Diet could shorten life

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Low Carb Diet could shorten life

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Old 09-07-18, 11:58 AM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by wgscott View Post
Be sure to write the editors of The Lancet and report your anecdotal findings and refutation.
https://www.ucdavis.edu/news/eat-fat-live-longer/
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Old 09-07-18, 11:59 AM
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https://www.healthline.com/nutrition...-low-fat-diets
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Old 09-07-18, 12:07 PM
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ok

Quick Summary
Mice ..
So a mouse study published in 2017 refutes a human study published in the best UK medical journal in 2018?

Next up: Intelligent Design study refutes Darwinian evolution.
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Old 09-07-18, 12:21 PM
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Here are several scientific studies that has proven that a low carb, high fat diet helps reduce inflamation which helps with many diseases. https://www.dietdoctor.com/low-carb/science#safety
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Old 09-07-18, 12:42 PM
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Assuming they are correct (I have no idea), it still isn't a refutation of the Lancet paper, which deals with outcome in terms of lifespan.
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Old 09-07-18, 03:37 PM
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One more link. I promise I'll quiit.

Latest Low-Carb Study: All Politics, No Science

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/diagnosis-diet/201809/latest-low-carb-study-all-politics-no-science
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Old 09-07-18, 03:38 PM
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Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
first of all, so what if they want to show the benefits of their religions? And what would those benefits be in the context of food? They have members from meat eaters all the way to vegans. If you have an issue with their scientific methods, then state so.
And I find it slightly amusing that you'd slight their studies by saying that they're non-peer-reviewed, but yet your original complaints is that all these nutritional studies (in peer review journals) are all wrong. So what'll it be? You can't cherry pick when to use peer reviews to support your stance and then blast them later when they don't.
And furthermore, you seem to trust peer reviews too easily. There are plenty of industry-funded studies that make their way into peer review journals, plenty of industry supported gun for hire diet doctors preaching the high fat diet. It's a bit of a joke to see see studies funded by the Atkins foundation make their way into these journals (because we all know what the conclusion of an Atkins Foundation or meat industry study is going to say; can't disappoint the hands that feed you the research funds eh). Makes one wonders if these journals are all that much better off than populist magazines.
ah, too bad you didn't (probably couldn't) read the study posted in #12 . I can't get it free in a PDF. But no, Adventists are vegetarians. That's the point of their studies. No meat eaters, sorry. You should read the articles on the link to their website which I provided.

Your last paragraph is pretty much exactly the viewpoint of the JAMA article I tried to link to. All these epidemiological studies are contaminated by researcher bias, though the Loma Linda studies are the most egregious examples I've seen.

There are a few 1-year range RCTs which are quite good. Mostly they show there's not much difference in outcomes between isocaloric diets, but of course no RCTs at all for all cause mortality.
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Old 09-08-18, 01:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy View Post


All these epidemiological studies are contaminated by researcher bias, though the Loma Linda studies are the most egregious examples I've seen.

True, true...

Metaanalysis is a statisticalanalysis that consists of huge collections of outcomes for the purpose of integrating the findings. The idea behind conducting Metaanalysis is to help the researcher by providing certain methodological literature that the researcher wants to obtain from the experimental research.
With this type of approach you can pretty much prove that eating chicken skin will shorten your life by 4.7 years but if you also drink up to 3 cups of coffee a day, your life is only shortened about 1.8 years, unless... you also eat two or more servings of kippered herring a week in which case you'll probably outlive everyone.
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Old 09-08-18, 10:11 AM
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Originally Posted by McBTC View Post
True, true...



With this type of approach you can pretty much prove that eating chicken skin will shorten your life by 4.7 years but if you also drink up to 3 cups of coffee a day, your life is only shortened about 1.8 years, unless... you also eat two or more servings of kippered herring a week in which case you'll probably outlive everyone.
Quite. A quote from the JAMA article I posted:
Assuming the meta-analyzed evidence from cohort studies represents life span–long causal associations, for a baseline life expectancy of 80 years, nonexperts presented with only relative risks may falsely infer that eating 12 hazelnuts daily (1 oz) would prolong life by 12 years (ie, 1 year per hazelnut),1 drinking 3 cups of coffee daily would achieve a similar gain of 12 extra years,2 and eating a single mandarin orange daily (80 g) would add 5 years of life.1 Conversely, consuming 1 egg daily would reduce life expectancy by 6 years, and eating 2 slices of bacon (30 g) daily would shorten life by a decade, an effect worse than smoking.1 Could these results possibly be true?
and
Burden-of-disease studies and guidelines endorse these estimates. Even when authors add caveats, results are still often presented by the media as causal.

These implausible estimates of benefits or risks associated with diet probably reflect almost exclusively the magnitude of the cumulative biases in this type of research, with extensive residual confounding and selective reporting.​​​
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Old 09-08-18, 11:04 PM
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How do you know when you will die?

And do you really WANT to?

People debating this is absurd.
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Old 09-13-18, 01:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest View Post
For the anecdotal record:

My performance has been suffering on the bike lately. It takes me longer to get warmed up, I can't stay over my LTHR for more than a second, I can't take hills at race pace. I can go fast on flat ground just below my threshold, but I don't have any anaerobic to give. This is completely new to me. Also, for what it's worth, I've been struggling in the weight room. This has been going on for about a month, although I've barely been on the bike the last two weeks.

I've been keeping a food journal and it shows that I've been getting 20 to 30 % of my calories from carbohydrates lately. That's extremely low carb. I'd never do that intentionally, it's just a consequence of trying to eat a high protein diet and stay under a calorie goal - and, apparently, do it in an unhealthy way. I eat apples and oranges and berries and even some chocolate, so it wasn't obvious to me, but when you add everything up, I'm in the low carb group. And my performance is clearly suffering for it. I'm starting to eat more carbs to fix this.
Keep us updated. I'm interested in your results.
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Old 09-14-18, 04:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy View Post
ah, too bad you didn't (probably couldn't) read the study posted in #12 . I can't get it free in a PDF.
Here you go:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/15y29dqxc3...80095.pdf?dl=1
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Old 09-14-18, 05:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Sojodave View Post
psychologytoday
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Old 09-16-18, 11:14 AM
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Originally Posted by wgscott View Post
Belated thanks for that.
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Old 09-21-18, 10:21 AM
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Originally Posted by smashndash View Post
Keep us updated. I'm interested in your results.
I've been making a point to eat more carbs lately. Still don't always get enough, and I need to spend some time rethinking my diet, but I'm getting more now. And I've regained my ability to ride my bike in a spirited manner. Time up all my hills is reduced, I'm putting out more power, and I'm having more fun on the bike because of it all.
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Old 09-21-18, 06:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest View Post
I've been making a point to eat more carbs lately. Still don't always get enough, and I need to spend some time rethinking my diet, but I'm getting more now. And I've regained my ability to ride my bike in a spirited manner. Time up all my hills is reduced, I'm putting out more power, and I'm having more fun on the bike because of it all.
How do you even manage to do low-carb on a vegetarian diet and still get enough calories to sustain an active lifestyle ??...Most vegetarian foods are high in carbs, right ??
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Old 09-21-18, 08:54 PM
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My thinking is that a 14oz well done NY cut, aged, certified Black Angus steak qualifies as, all things in moderation, if only three times a year...
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Old 09-24-18, 09:30 AM
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Originally Posted by wolfchild View Post
How do you even manage to do low-carb on a vegetarian diet and still get enough calories to sustain an active lifestyle ??...Most vegetarian foods are high in carbs, right ??
Yeah. It's pretty weird, isn't it? That's why it took me a while to realize what was going on. At first I just thought I sucked at hills all of a sudden.

Trying to lose some weight I put on in the spring, I wound up eating lots of yogurt, skip lunch, lots of fake meat things for dinner with a vegetable, and dialing way back on a lot of other stuff. I've been having veggie burgers without the bun, stuff like that.
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Old 09-24-18, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by wolfchild View Post
How do you even manage to do low-carb on a vegetarian diet and still get enough calories to sustain an active lifestyle ??...Most vegetarian foods are high in carbs, right ??
Vegans (very strict vegetarians that don't eat dairy products, eggs, or other stuff that originates with animals) might run into this more than someone like me.

As a lazy vegetarian, I have however found it possible to pack on the pounds due to too much carbohydrate. You still have to eat carefully.
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Old 09-24-18, 11:04 AM
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Maybe a forward-thinking natural foods grocery store could put aside a 'hunting and gathering' section for those on the, Kumeyaay Indian Diet. I can't remember the last time I enjoyed a heaping bowl of acorn meal and chewed a stalk of mescal...


The Kumeyaay Indians gathered many foods from their environment. The women gathered wild fruits, roots, bulbs, seeds, and nuts. The gathering was done by season. The Kumeyaay's most important food source was acorns produced by the oak tree and it gave them a good supply of food for an entire year. All the men, women, and children helped collect acorns. They gathered all sorts of berries like blackberries and strawberries. The men traveled to the desert to gather mescal stalks (shown above). Gathering was an important source of the Kumeyaay's food.



https://sites.google.com/site/kumeya...gathering-food
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Old 09-24-18, 01:49 PM
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You don't really live longer if you eat less red meat. It just seems longer.
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