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There's No School Like the Old School

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There's No School Like the Old School

Old 01-20-19, 06:56 PM
  #1  
fstrnu
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There's No School Like the Old School

Like learning long division to ensure that you understand math even though you will use a calculator for it later, all cyclists should understand how to training without software. Only once you know what you are talking about can you then evaluate the many trade-off's associated with using generic SW. New cyclists or cyclists new to structured training should skip the smart trainer and grab a dumb trainer instead. Start doing intervals. Increase cadence then gear to increase external load while monitoring internal load. Smart trainers do nothing for you if all you're doing is using it to allow software to tell you to do the same thing that everyone else is doing.
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Old 01-20-19, 07:04 PM
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I wholeheartedly disagree. There's absolutely no reason to avoid a smart trainer and ERG files. There's not a thing wrong with a new cyclist doing 20-28 weeks of Trainerroad or similar to get an understanding of what they're doing.It's pretty disrespectful to think that all new cyclist are blinded by the light of generic plans. Especially when you're offering completely generic and derivative intervals.

In b4 the dead horse icon.......
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Old 01-21-19, 12:11 AM
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It is hard to beat the dead horse in. I am in as well.
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Old 01-21-19, 12:28 AM
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Old 01-21-19, 01:36 AM
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Originally Posted by fstrnu View Post
Like learning long division to ensure that you understand math even though you will use a calculator for it later, all cyclists should understand how to training without software. Only once you know what you are talking about can you then evaluate the many trade-off's associated with using generic SW. New cyclists or cyclists new to structured training should skip the smart trainer and grab a dumb trainer instead. Start doing intervals. Increase cadence then gear to increase external load while monitoring internal load. Smart trainers do nothing for you if all you're doing is using it to allow software to tell you to do the same thing that everyone else is doing.

Are you selling something?

Or are you just a luddite?

Do you ride a bicycle?
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Old 01-21-19, 09:57 AM
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Do this. 1 x 120 if you have time today. If you don't have two hours today but can do 90 minutes today and tomorrow then do that. If you only have 90 minutes today then do 6 x 10 tempo today. If you don't have 90 minutes, then do 4 x 8 SST. Recover. Repeat.
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Old 01-21-19, 10:30 AM
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As part of the age cadre that started racing time trials with a mechanical stopwatch on the handlebars I'd like to announce that it's not 1969 anymore.

-Bandera
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Old 01-21-19, 04:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Bandera View Post
As part of the age cadre that started racing time trials with a mechanical stopwatch on the handlebars I'd like to announce that it's not 1969 anymore.

-Bandera
We were oxygen constrained in 1969 and we are still oxygen constrained today.
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Old 01-21-19, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Hermes View Post


We were oxygen constrained in 1969 and we are still oxygen constrained today.
Only more so as the Alveoli exchange gas without their old vim, vigor and youthful 'Elan.

-Bandera
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Old 01-21-19, 09:21 PM
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Originally Posted by fstrnu View Post
Do this. 1 x 120 if you have time today. If you don't have two hours today but can do 90 minutes today and tomorrow then do that. If you only have 90 minutes today then do 6 x 10 tempo today. If you don't have 90 minutes, then do 4 x 8 SST. Recover. Repeat.
Why in the name of the great spirit would I do that? Blech. Instead my dear wife and I rode our tandem yesterday for 4:18 on a 56 mile hilly ride. Yeah, we're old and slow, but we did get 10 PRs including 1 on the big climb of the day. It's all "compared to what?" Tomorrow is 1 hour of VT1 including 30' of pedaling as fast as I can, then go to the gym and lift everything in sight for an hour, then try to walk as as far as the car. Next day, run 3 miles. Etc..
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Old 01-21-19, 11:33 PM
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Originally Posted by fstrnu View Post
Do this. 1 x 120 if you have time today. If you don't have two hours today but can do 90 minutes today and tomorrow then do that. If you only have 90 minutes today then do 6 x 10 tempo today. If you don't have 90 minutes, then do 4 x 8 SST. Recover. Repeat.
No.

That's not part of my current personal training program.

Also, with the quantity of smoke from bushfires out there, it is not advisable to do excessive exercise, especially if a person has asthma.


What did you do today?
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Old 01-22-19, 12:56 AM
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200 km, Monday, Wednesday and Friday. Small chainring only, since it's January. Wear your spare tubs like bandoliers. No stops. No eating during training rides. One water bottle only. Stragglers make their own way home.
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Old 01-22-19, 01:40 AM
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I'm sure each of us in this thread could come up with a training plan for you @fstrnu ...

We don't know your goals, but apparently that doesn't matter.
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Old 01-22-19, 07:08 AM
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Originally Posted by fstrnu View Post
Do this..
Uh, No.
That is insufficiently Old School for me.
As a cyclist I actually go outside for an hour or two on the fixed gear bike putting in the traditional winter base miles in real Old School style.

-Bandera
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Old 01-22-19, 07:38 AM
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Originally Posted by canklecat View Post
200 km, Monday, Wednesday and Friday. Small chainring Fixed gear only, since it's January. Wear your spare tubs like bandoliers. No stops. No eating during training rides. One water bottle only. Stragglers make their own way home.
"Fixed" it for you.

See what I did there?


-Tim-
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Old 01-22-19, 08:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Bandera View Post
Uh, No.
That is insufficiently Old School for me.
As a cyclist I actually go outside for an hour or two on the fixed gear bike putting in the traditional winter base miles in real Old School style.

-Bandera
Having you in an old school cycling discussion is like having Mozart attend an old school music composition class - maestro.

Did you ever race in Madison Square Garden?

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Old 01-22-19, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Hermes View Post
Did you ever race in Madison Square Garden?
@Hermes,

I'm not quite that old, but my 1st coach did race on the board tracks pre-WWII.
He was truly Old School......

-Bandera
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Old 01-22-19, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by TimothyH View Post
"Fixed" it for you.

See what I did there?


-Tim-
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Old 01-22-19, 10:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Bandera View Post
@Hermes,

I'm not quite that old, but my 1st coach did race on the board tracks pre-WWII.
He was truly Old School......

-Bandera
I knew that you were not that old but the vintage footage of the Madison is fun to watch. I like the way they did the Madison push on the exchange versus a throw that is done today.

Today, I did a sprinters warmup, accelerations and jumps and then two laps around Fiesta Island 24 minutes (a real island in San Diego not somewhere in cyberspace) of low cadence work on my TT bike 55-60 cadence. 54/11 gearing. The goal is strength and adaptation on the TT bike. So Maestro, is that old school or new?
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Old 01-22-19, 11:08 PM
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Originally Posted by fstrnu View Post
Increase cadence then gear to increase external load while monitoring internal load.
What are external and internal load?

Not trying to challenge but am sincerely asking.


-Tim-
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Old 01-23-19, 03:43 AM
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Originally Posted by canklecat View Post
200 km, Monday, Wednesday and Friday. Small chainring only, since it's January. Wear your spare tubs like bandoliers. No stops. No eating during training rides. One water bottle only. Stragglers make their own way home.
What idiot, in the middle of summer, rides 200 km non-stop without food and only one bottle of water?
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Old 01-23-19, 03:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Thunder Horse View Post
What idiot, in the middle of summer, rides 200 km non-stop without food and only one bottle of water?
Some guy named Eddy Merckx. I dunno. That sounds like a fake name. Probably knew nothing about riding bikes. But supposedly that was for January training only. Not summer.
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Old 01-23-19, 07:18 AM
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Originally Posted by TimothyH View Post
What are external and internal load?

Not trying to challenge but am sincerely asking.


-Tim-
No worries. External load is the work you do. Internal load is the impact it has on your body.
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Old 01-23-19, 08:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Hermes View Post
: The goal is strength and adaptation on the TT bike. So Maestro, is that old school or new?
That is good solid common sense combined with advanced post-graduate Old School study and modern kit.
Being strong across the cadence range is a good thing then/now but it takes dedicated work, or winning the genetic lottery.

The modern TT machine is a marvel of aerodynamics and bio-mechanics but it must take considerable adaptation to be able to hold a proper position while putting out big power, high speed and being firmly in control for the duration of the event. ( If someone would let my local Triathletes know that the latter is a requirement for operating a bicycle on the open public roads I would appreciate it.) Time and effort well spent yesterday out on the TT bike instead of dreadful Sisyphean indoor struggles with a virtual boulder and hill.

I wonder how fast Beryl Burton would have be able to have gone on a modern TT machine? Very, very Fast no doubt.



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Last edited by Bandera; 01-23-19 at 02:15 PM.
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Old 01-23-19, 01:40 PM
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Originally Posted by fstrnu View Post
No worries. External load is the work you do. Internal load is the impact it has on your body.
Hi.....

Can you better define:

external load - the work you do. I am assuming this is work in kilojoules?
internal load - the impact it has on your body. What is this? Can you give me a formula?

Will you give me an example worksheet for 6 weeks of your data that shows how you quantify external load, internal load, cardiac drift, etc, etc, etc, and the calculations involved so I can duplicate your work?
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