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Calorie Question

Old 04-24-21, 07:33 PM
  #26  
unterhausen
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I'm curious what Carbonfibeboy's best time for 300km was. A little over 14 hours for me, which isn't all that fast for a randonneur. We're talking different levels of performance. Tbh, I am suspicious you have an eating disorder.
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Old 04-25-21, 10:32 AM
  #27  
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Was that 300 kms' all in one go? man that would be a long day of riding. I'm impressed when I do 100km, which would be about 4 hours for me, including normal traffic stops, probably a few rests along the way. I average about 25km/hr on my normal long rides, calculating a lot of starting and stopping as I go through the build up part of town until I get to open space.

I don't eat much as I'm riding and I have a bad habit of not drinking enough water. One ride last summer, after about 60 km's and very warm temperatures I came home feeling fine but not long after I bonked. That was the only time I realized I did not provide my body with what it needed.
I am starving when i come from a ride though, it's just something I don't notice while actually riding.
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Old 04-25-21, 11:30 AM
  #28  
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14 hours including stops.

The useful maximum rate of eating is only 300 calories/hr. On a long ride I might eat more than that at a stop, but with the recognition that digestion will be slow and it will affect my performance. The best 100 mile ride I ever had was after a lunch stop on a 1200km ride where I ate a cheesesteak and some fries.

We're getting off topic a little. It seems clear that what I said first is still the best idea, eat a small snack before riding the 30 minutes, or do it soon after a meal time.
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Old 04-25-21, 12:03 PM
  #29  
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As a health care provider and a fat guy I personally have to watch my calories and consul others on watching thier calories. Many times I get patients who get carried away with trying to count Fat Calories, Carbs, Protein Loads, and Keto Counts.

My advise has been to start off counting just calories and protein in you diet. After you achieve an athletic weight then branch out into others ways of monitoring your diet.

Its the same way with your work out. I would suggest gauging your work out on whether you broke a sweat or not. At the point you are sweating profusely you have attained a workout peak.

There are people who go to a gym and work out for long periods of time without breaking a sweat. So does that count? Yes... Of course.

There are people who break a sweat just getting thier groceries to the car. So does that count? Yes... Of Course.

I don't mean to sound confusing. What I am saying is to watch your calories and protein intake; and know that if you have worked out to the point of sweating profusely you have accomplished a reasonable workout.

In general ya want to stay above 1200 calories, and at least 90 grams of protein per day. You should have at lest 3 litres of water a day for sure (even in the winter time).

Also: Stay hydrated and... BONKING is Bad.
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Old 05-05-21, 12:10 AM
  #30  
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I went from 220 to 184 doing 10 minutes on bike three times a day. But I also went really hard every time. Not pass out hard but I made sure I was huffing by the end of it. I actually cant do stationary bike any other way its way too boring for me. I was losing an average of 2 pounds a week.
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Old 05-05-21, 05:59 AM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by Nasr313 View Post
I went from 220 to 184 doing 10 minutes on bike three times a day. But I also went really hard every time. Not pass out hard but I made sure I was huffing by the end of it. I actually cant do stationary bike any other way its way too boring for me. I was losing an average of 2 pounds a week.
No way you burnt 7000 calories per week by doing 210 mins of exercise. You must have changed your diet as well?

I burn 25cal per mile on flat ground.
7000/25 = 280 miles
280miles in 210min = 80mph
id say youd be plenty huffing at 80mph on a stationary bike!


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Old 05-05-21, 02:28 PM
  #32  
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I tend to burn ~100 cal/hr on my fatbike. I'd need a lot of hours to burn 7000. I've done ~5000/day for 3 days but that was a lot longer than the 420 minutes rated time the above would suggest for me. More like 900 minutes to burn 15k. So I'm feeling inadequate since i only burn 1/2 that rate.

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Old 05-05-21, 02:36 PM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by Bearhawker View Post
I tend to burn ~100 cal/hr on my fatbike. I'd need a lot of hours to burn 7000. I've done ~5000/day for 3 days but that was a lot longer than the 420 minutes rated time the above would suggest for me. More like 900 minutes to burn 15k. So I'm feeling inadequate since i only burn 1/2 that rate.

That seems really low. Is it an e-bike?
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Old 05-07-21, 09:33 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by unterhausen View Post
I'm curious what Carbonfibeboy's best time for 300km was. A little over 14 hours for me, which isn't all that fast for a randonneur. We're talking different levels of performance. Tbh, I am suspicious you have an eating disorder.
I didn't see this because no quote.

I was using different equipment then and don't have an elapsed for sure for that 300k. It was a little over 300k. 195.5 miles in 12:02 saddle time. I know I was under 13 hours, but I don't remember by how much - not much though. I was solo for most of it and didn't stop much or for long - no one to talk to. 9700' of climbing. It was a really fun ride, a good bit of flat, one pass, lots of steep rolling hills. I'd missed the 300k brevet the week previous, so started with a friend on the Thursday. He A-fibbed out at about 70 miles and called his wife. He was OK, I went on solo.

A few weeks before, I'd done a 200k in a hair under 8 hrs. elapsed. I was 62 then. A year later, I did a 400k in a hair under 15 hours elapsed, but only 6000' or so climbing, so a pretty easy ride and I had a 4 person paceline about half of the way. The next year, I did a mountain 400k in about 15:30 saddle time and ~18:30 elapsed, ~13k' climbing IIRC, riding solo - I had an early flat which then flatted again later. That was before I started carrying a spare tire. That was a tough ride. Our RBA took us up an 18% grade after the last pass, with about 60k still to go. I was OK though, pulled another guy at 20 on the flat near the finish. Only had to ride for about an hour in the dark at the end - we'd started after it got a little light..

That ride was through mostly lonesome country, little water. I grabbed some water from a stream, which was not good. I woke up in the night after I got home, so sick I said the shema. It was just crypto though. Rando is pretty fun.
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Old 05-08-21, 07:05 AM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by caloso View Post
That seems really low. Is it an e-bike?
nope - but maybe I missed a zero.

on the days I was burning ~5000cal/day it was over 5-6 hours, climbing sometimes 1900m in a day

Checking strava - my last ride was less than 30 minutes with a calculated ~600 calories. Avg HR was 178, max 205. AVg speed ~20km/h. Definitely NOT an e-bike. haha

so 1000/hour might make sense

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Old 05-08-21, 07:54 AM
  #36  
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IMHO - I f youre not using a power meter, Stravas calorie calcs are a joke. They are way too high.
You can prove this, get two riders on the same ride where one runs a PM. Then compare.
once you add a power meter the numbers are a known factor.
Your average human is not as efficient as you might hope. For every 1 calorie we produce, we burn ~4.2 calories to do it.

So with a power meter, estimating calorie burn becomes far more accurate.
very helpful if youre attempting to net zero during workouts.

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Old 05-08-21, 09:58 AM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by Bearhawker View Post
nope - but maybe I missed a zero.

on the days I was burning ~5000cal/day it was over 5-6 hours, climbing sometimes 1900m in a day

Checking strava - my last ride was less than 30 minutes with a calculated ~600 calories. Avg HR was 178, max 205. AVg speed ~20km/h. Definitely NOT an e-bike. haha

so 1000/hour might make sense

1000 kcal/hr works out to 275 watts. 600kcal for 30 minutes works out to 333 watts. At 20kph. . . perhaps a very steep climb?
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Old 05-08-21, 04:39 PM
  #38  
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East coast wind & no way to get "aero" on a fatbike.
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Old 05-10-21, 04:00 AM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by Barry2 View Post
IMHO - I f youre not using a power meter, Stravas calorie calcs are a joke. They are way too high.
You can prove this, get two riders on the same ride where one runs a PM. Then compare.
once you add a power meter the numbers are a known factor.
Your average human is not as efficient as you might hope. For every 1 calorie we produce, we burn ~4.2 calories to do it.

So with a power meter, estimating calorie burn becomes far more accurate.
very helpful if youre attempting to net zero during workouts.

Barry
The efficiency thing is as much a problem for Strava estimates as it is for power meter results. Both calorie estimates need to make an assumption of the human efficiency in producing power.
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Old 05-10-21, 04:04 AM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by caloso View Post
1000 kcal/hr works out to 275 watts. 600kcal for 30 minutes works out to 333 watts. At 20kph. . . perhaps a very steep climb?
And also 275W avg for 5-6 hours is elite pro cycling territory.
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Old 05-10-21, 04:41 PM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy View Post
It's been fairly well established that not eating during a ride of over an hour will backfire, causing one to eat more after the ride, more total calories that if one had eaten during the ride and avoided becoming ravenously hungry.
Has that really been established? Because it seems to me that an hour of riding would barely scratch a person's glycogen stores.

I never eat anything on a ride less than 2 hours, and I'm never ravenously hungry afterwards.
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Old 05-10-21, 10:43 PM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by terrymorse View Post
Has that really been established? Because it seems to me that an hour of riding would barely scratch a person's glycogen stores.

I never eat anything on a ride less than 2 hours, and I'm never ravenously hungry afterwards.
Well, maybe I was a little too strong there . . .

Everybody's different and long training to do a particular thing works. We've had many riders complaining that when they don't eat on the bike, they come back and clean out the fridge. I don't notice it either when I'm fit, and I do about the same as you. I think the problem arises when unfit riders use up their blood sugar and their glycogen doesn't come in to replace it right away. I know there's a big difference in my fueling behavior when I'm fit.
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Old 05-11-21, 09:05 AM
  #43  
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I'll throw it out there.........a lot of folks don't burn as much as they think they do on rides. A less trained person and a trained person may eat close to the same amount after a ride. But the trained person possibly burned 50 to 100% more during the ride. Both people's gut can only take in so much at the after ride snack or meal. But one person did more than the other.

Lots of people snack after a ride, some do recovery drinks. Etc... It just matters if the post-ride and in-ride nutrition balances out with the work.

TT bike did 940KJ the other day in an hour at just under 40k race pace (over 260w for an hour). Week before 1030KJ in 75min at sweetspot (just below 260w).

That's a lot different than doing only 500KJ in that hour. Especially multiplied over weeks and weeks.

It's really hard starting out and having the low hourly output but having the hunger when done. Just hold tight. Water, wise snack choices. Eat the snack slowly, don't wolf it down. Etc... It will get better. Don't starve yourself. Eat when hungry.
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Old 05-11-21, 12:24 PM
  #44  
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Having a HR Strap & Power Meter is the only way to get even remotely accurate expended calories. I use both and also use the Garmin Smart Eat prompt to help stay fueled up. Even on long rides the prompt doesn't come close to having me eat maybe even a third of what I've burned by the end of the ride.
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Old 05-11-21, 02:09 PM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by SCTinkering View Post
Having a HR Strap & Power Meter is the only way to get even remotely accurate expended calories. I use both and also use the Garmin Smart Eat prompt to help stay fueled up. Even on long rides the prompt doesn't come close to having me eat maybe even a third of what I've burned by the end of the ride.
Also, you don't want to eat during the ride even close to what you burn during the ride. Because if you are even remotely in shape, then you are able to burn far more than what you can digest during the ride. Eating more during the ride would just cause discomfort and most likely stomach problems.
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Old 05-17-21, 04:08 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by SCTinkering View Post
Having a HR Strap & Power Meter is the only way to get even remotely accurate expended calories.
Hr strap doesn't matter in the least.

Power meter measures actual kJ. As good as you're going to get on the open road.
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Old 05-18-21, 12:17 PM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by rubiksoval View Post
Hr strap doesn't matter in the least.

Power meter measures actual kJ. As good as you're going to get on the open road.
To get kJ, you have to upload to a website that'll calculate that for you. I use both HR and power and compare my kJ to what the HRM reports for calories and they just aren't the same, sometimes not even close. Go by the kJ. That said, the HRM is still a very good training aid because unlike a PM, it reports on your physiological state, which may not have all that much to do with how hard you're pushing on the pedals. If you HR seems unusually high for the amount of power you're putting out, you're probably dehydrated. If your HR seems unusually low for your power, you probably need to eat - your blood sugar is dropping out.

On really long rides, say over 6 hours, I ride more by HR than by power. I watch my power, but gauge my effort by HR because what one needs to do on a long ride is to limit physiological stress. Unless one has ridden the course before and has a good memory, going by power you'll either over or undercook yourself. Which is not the subject of this thread, and brings up another subject, how to limit by HR but that's another discussion altogether.

I usually eat when I'm hungry, and on long rides, eat about half my kJ, though during the ride it's impossible to know what that is, hence I eat when hungry or feel like I'm about to cry, which works out to about half kJ in the end.
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Old 05-18-21, 12:40 PM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy View Post
and on long rides, eat about half my kJ, though during the ride it's impossible to know what that is,
Some Bike Computers are able to display Cals in real-time during the ride.
Wahoo Bolt & Roam for example.

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Old 05-18-21, 12:49 PM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by Barry2 View Post
Some Bike Computers are able to display Cals in real-time during the ride.
Wahoo Bolt & Roam for example.

Barry
And those Cals are calculated from kJ. Good to know.
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Old 05-18-21, 12:57 PM
  #50  
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this is something good for me to Know. my e bike has a watt meter because it has a torque sensor. plus it has my HR. I get mabye 250 calories burned on my 31 minute commute that putting out a average of 170 to 200 watts and a heart rate around 130 though it averages lower because of the stop signs. on my 40 mile ride where I averaged 152 to 160 watts and a heart rate of 130 over 2.4 hours It shows around 1300 calories. my garmin shows a little under but it does not have my watts only my HR trying to work out how accurate it is?
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