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Benefit of Protein shakes/recovery drinks when focused on losing weight

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Benefit of Protein shakes/recovery drinks when focused on losing weight

Old 09-07-09, 09:15 PM
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WhiskeySmack
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Benefit of Protein shakes/recovery drinks when focused on losing weight

I'm curious as to what are the benefits of drinking protein shakes either by making them myself or drinking Muscle Milk or something similar when my focus is on losing weight.

I'm currently 265lbs at 6'3 and believe I have about 80lbs to lose. Would my weight loss benefit from drinking protein shakes after rides? Or should I just focus on riding a lot and eating healthy?

I don't really understand why people would use this stuff, unless you can't get enough prrotien from eating eggs, chicken, etc.. right after a ride.

If I should be supplimenting my nutrition, can you recommend the best products that would help in losing weight?
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Old 09-07-09, 10:34 PM
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Most people use it for the simple reason of...marketing works. People think they need it, because ads tell them they do.

The purpose of a recovery drink, is to speed recovery so an athlete can be ready to perform sooner. If your eating healthy, and only doing whatever sporting event once a day, at a reasonable level, you'll recover fine without it. If your at a high competitive level and doing multiple training events a day, or doing long endurance events multiple days, then its worthwhile.

Testing of cyclists on recovery drinks, found chocolate milk just as effective as the expensive ones. So your right, for your case it'll most likely just be adding colories to your diet and removing money from your wallet.
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Old 09-08-09, 06:36 AM
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I've found protein supplementation useful when I'm working hard to add muscle at the gym. I've not noticed that it made any difference when I'm only riding. Presumably I already eat enough protein to build muscle outside of relatively intense training. I'm sure I could be more mindful of my diet to achieve the same end, but the shakes are convenient.

I found recovery shakes made a huge difference when I was extremely active: riding extensively in addition to playing hockey every day. When I'm less active, they are less useful. Again, they are convenient, especially if I don't have time or the circumstances to properly prepare post-exercise meals.

The bottom line is that you need nothing more than you can get at a grocery store to provide healthy post-exercise nutrition. Recovery products and diet supplements can be effective and are convenient, but you're going to pay for the convenience, marketing, etc.. In the context of weight loss, you need to maintain enough energy to actually exercise while keeping a total calorie deficit. You can integrate recovery and supplement products into that if you like and it could be helpful, but it's not necessary and may be detrimental depending upon how they affect your appetite.
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Old 09-08-09, 07:18 AM
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marketing for sure.

i use Hammer's Recoverite from time to time. its not a protein shake by any means. when i am putting in consecutive days of hard efforts it seems to help. later.
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Old 09-08-09, 07:37 AM
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You won't lose weight by comsuming more calories. Recovery drinks are useful for getting enough calories and rebuilding glycogen stores after a 2 hour + ride, if you have another one tomorrow. Otherwise, they're not needed.
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Old 09-08-09, 07:40 AM
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The only supplement you need to take is water. Staying hydrated while riding will let you ride harder and longer, burning more calories and forcing your metabolic rate up more for the day. Rather than protein supplements I'd buy something like the smallest size Gelert hydration pack off ebay for $20-$30. If you want to make the fluid isotonic, add some Kool Aid and a little Lo-Salt and sugar.
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Old 09-08-09, 09:15 AM
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The first reply was pretty spot on, recovery drinks are nothing but marketing for the most part. Stick to a healthy diet of mostly fruits and vegetables if you want to get the most change, if you wanna add additional protein i would go for something along the lines of raw hemp protein powder. I think the other big draw to drinks, powders, pills and tonics is that they give you the illusion that you can eat whatever you want as long as u take your supplements, which is as far from the truth as you could get
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Old 09-08-09, 11:03 AM
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Thanks for the advice folks. Much appreciated.
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Old 09-08-09, 03:13 PM
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Originally Posted by WhiskeySmack View Post
I'm curious as to what are the benefits of drinking protein shakes either by making them myself or drinking Muscle Milk or something similar when my focus is on losing weight.

I'm currently 265lbs at 6'3 and believe I have about 80lbs to lose. Would my weight loss benefit from drinking protein shakes after rides? Or should I just focus on riding a lot and eating healthy?

I don't really understand why people would use this stuff, unless you can't get enough prrotien from eating eggs, chicken, etc.. right after a ride.

If I should be supplimenting my nutrition, can you recommend the best products that would help in losing weight?
If you have 80 lbs to lose you need to evaluate what you eat everyday, not just after your rides. Your body is like a sponge right after a hard ride. No matter what you eat, unless it is processed food or fast food, your body will use for recovery purposes and won't store as fat. It is your everyday eating that will determine if you lose weight or not. A good rule of thumb is, 90% or your meals should be made of lean protein, complex carbs, and good fats. The other 10% eat what you want. Make sure your portion sizes are correct and try to eat about 5 times a day.

If you ride hard for 2+ hours a recovery drink is going to be beneficial to you. A recovery drink makes it easy to determine how many carbs, protein etc you are taking in right after your ride. After your ride your body is in a depleted state and is craving a fast source of carbs and protien. This is where a recovery drink comes in handy. Two good recovery drinks on the market are Recovery by Velo Sports Nutrition (available in about 2 weeks, PM me if you want a sample), and Ultragen by First Endurance.

There are no products out there that will help you lose weight, eating right with the correct portions and exercise are the keys to losing weight.
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Old 09-08-09, 08:21 PM
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I like to use whey protein because it is convenient and tastes good in my smoothie. Also it's a concentrated high quality protein. Suppose you eat a lot of beans. They have protein, right? well it's not complete (missing some essential amino acids). Or if you eat red meat or even chicken. It often has a lot of "bad fats" or doesn't taste good in a smoothie.

If you find that weight loss is more forthcoming by eating a standard "formula" then the whey protein might help. I would just get Walmart or Sams brand of whey protein in a 5 lb bag. Relatively cheap.

I don't think I'd use milk as a substitute because (1) it has a fairly large amount of sugar in it and (2) might cost more per gram of protein, than the whey concentrate.

You really only need about 1 gram of protein per KG of lean body weight (you can subtract the weight due to fat, since it is not really very metabolically active). So your goal weight of about 185 lb, is about 85 kg, and you can get 20 to 25 g of protein per scoop of whey. Try to use one scoop in your home made shake. Add fruits (and even vegetables, for a more "advanced" smoothie) to the shake. A great tasting add in is frozen berries (can get at Sams too). Add water (or milk if you prefer).

If losing weight, exercise and cut the calories. Some people on weight loss diets get inadequate amounts of protein. So the Whey supplement can help prevent this pitfall. Without adequate protein, I think you're more likely to lose fat and valuable muscle mass at the same time, not always a worthy goal.
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Old 09-09-09, 05:50 AM
  #11  
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Most Americans get way to much protein. For example the FDA recommends about 65 grams of protein on a 2000 calorie diet. For example you will get close to half of that with a single 3oz serving of chicken breast. (about the size of a deck of cards) Now some people, especially from the bodybuiding crowd, take in a lot more protein, but if you are trying to lose weight that is just going to be more calories your body has to burn.

It is pretty simple, you need to burn more calories than you take in. While there is a lot of debate as to what ratio you should take these calories in as, I lost over 170 pounds with an approximate ration of 50% carbs, 30% protein, 20% fat. Note that is the caloric ration not the ratio in grams since a gram of fat has more calories than a gram of carbs/protein.

The single best piece of advice I can give you is to decide what you works for you, and then log everything you eat and your exercise. Once you can tabulate what your body is taking and what you are burning you can adjust from there. Don't be fooled by marketing gimmicks or anything else, the formula is pretty simple, sticking to it is what is harder.
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Old 09-09-09, 06:12 AM
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Read this on another site and thought it applied here.. one fact that has been skipped...is that if you are under maybe 180lbs in bodyweight, it should be beyond easy enough for you to get all of the protein you need from food sources alone with no supplementation needed at all.
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Old 09-09-09, 09:31 AM
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Unless you're out busting a gut on the bike you don't need a post workout shake. Skipping it is an easy way to cut calories. Just proceed with your next scheduled meal.
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Old 09-09-09, 09:49 AM
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I don't think all that much of recovery drinks. It's the modern version of snake oil in my opinion.

However, I do consume protein whey as part of my regular diet since I don't eat red meat. If your looking to lose a considerable amount of weight make sure to include alot of protein in your diet. There are enough natural sources of protein, especially if you eat meat.

Your better off getting too much protein while your losing weight than not enough. Similiar to fiber, Protein makes you feel full. I've heard recommendations as high as 60% above the RDA. If you have a protein deficiency in your diet, your body will look elsewhere for a source of protein. The most readily available source in the body would be muscle tissue, so protein will get leached from the existing muscle mass. Which will result in your weight loss coming from lost muscle not lost fat.

And the RDA for protein is 50 grams, not what was previously stated.

Last edited by DX Rider; 09-09-09 at 02:08 PM.
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Old 09-20-09, 05:11 PM
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My degree is in exercise science, not nutrition, but I still feel qualified to say that marketing has replaced science and common sense in the area of nutrition. "Experts" write books, provide diet services, etc and get a certain degree of positive results mainly due to the fact that when people watch what they are eating, they take in fewer calories.

It's a sad fact that people in America think that a slice of whole grain bread is "bad" food because it is carbohydrate rich. Meanwhile, a hamburger, sans bun, is supposed to be diet food.

Anyway, I'll get off my soapbox and just say that a carb rich snack with a little protein and fat after a hard exercise session is a good idea, and will help speed recovery. There's no need to buy special commercial recovery products, but they are fine if you really know what's in them and you don't mind the extra cost.
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Old 09-20-09, 05:50 PM
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It seems like everyone on this thread is against the use of protein/diet supplements, so allow me to play devils advocate. As far as protein shakes go, it all depends on what you're trying to do. If, for example, you were training for a race or trying to increase your lean muscle mass, a protein shake immediately after your ride would be optimal for recovery when added to your normal post-ride fare. For the situation you described, however, you may want to focus more on healthy eating habits prior to/after rides so as to encourage weight loss (which would only be hindered by many protein supplements).

Now, that being said, I disagree with the notion that protein supplements in general are, as DX Rider put it, "snake oil". Taken appropriately, protein supplements are an easy and efficient way to get synthesized, high quality protein into your system directly after exercise. There is a threshold though, for the body can only absorb so much protein at a given time. It is because of this fact that many products, like Muscle Milk and Monster Milk etc., are not beneficial because they sell consumers based solely on the amount of protein in their product.

If, in the future, you're looking to gain muscle via a protein supplement, go to your local nutrition outlet and look into a less intensive whey or soy based protein powder while avoiding things like Muscle Milk and other supplements like it.

Last edited by OptionalStick3; 09-20-09 at 05:54 PM.
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Old 09-20-09, 06:17 PM
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I've no experience with those packaged protein/creatine/whatever-fancy-sounding-chemical drinks on the market. The only justification in using those products sparingly is if the convince factor outweighs the added cost of the product for you. It would be cheaper to formulate your own post-workout drink then to buy that muscle milk product.
I'm not sure what the needs of an endurance cyclist's shake might be but I've been following at mix of 50g protein, 25g creatine, a serving of BCAA and ~25g sugar to help with the absorption of the creatine and to prevent catabolic loss after my weight training sessions.
Since aerobic exercises already stresses your body to go catabolic I'd figure that having a protein rich diet, especially immediately after a workout, would help promote fat loss without the loss of muscle mass.
I agree fully with OptionalStick3's post, I don't understand the hate that protein has gotten in this thread since it is a crucial part of any diet and supplements help balance out your daily needs.

You could also look into doing HIIT training to cut the fat without muscle loss.
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Old 09-21-09, 02:47 AM
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In reading this, I feel I have to add my 2 cents. Now note, I am not a dietician. I have been working out with a personal trainer now for about 3 months. My weigh in when I started was 325lbs. Now my trainer is also a nutritionalist. Following his diet plan. which includes a morning low carb protein shake, I have lost 28lbs. I work out 3 days a week with him, and then cycle 3-4 days with mixed intensity. At this point, I am comfortably riding 25-30 miles a ride, and will be pushing out to a 50 mile ride soon.

My point is this. When I started trying to lose weight, I went to someone that I knew had the training and knowledge to answer my questions. Losing weight mattered so much to me that I made myself a priority. I laid down the money to have someone look at my current diet and calorie consumption. Then they were able to tell me where I needed to improve and more importantly how to do it. Go see your family doctor and have them recommend a nutritionalist. Most insurances will pay for one. If your going to do it, do it right.

If your looking for a nice meal replacement protein powder, I like the MRM product. It is low carb and doesnt taste too bad. I throw in fresh fruit and peanut butter to cover the carbs and dietary fat. My daily calorie consumption is approx 2000 a day. The nice thing about the morning protein shake is that is satisfies as 1 meal and keeps me satisfied till I need to eat my next scheduled meal.

Either way, good luck to you and keep spinning.
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Old 09-21-09, 04:26 AM
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Originally Posted by nazzo View Post
I've no experience with those packaged protein/creatine/whatever-fancy-sounding-chemical drinks on the market. The only justification in using those products sparingly is if the convince factor outweighs the added cost of the product for you. It would be cheaper to formulate your own post-workout drink then to buy that muscle milk product.
I'm not sure what the needs of an endurance cyclist's shake might be but I've been following at mix of 50g protein, 25g creatine, a serving of BCAA and ~25g sugar to help with the absorption of the creatine and to prevent catabolic loss after my weight training sessions.
Since aerobic exercises already stresses your body to go catabolic I'd figure that having a protein rich diet, especially immediately after a workout, would help promote fat loss without the loss of muscle mass.
I agree fully with OptionalStick3's post, I don't understand the hate that protein has gotten in this thread since it is a crucial part of any diet and supplements help balance out your daily needs.

You could also look into doing HIIT training to cut the fat without muscle loss.
Be careful! The most I have ever heard recommended for a single serving of creatine is 10g and that is only during the loading phase. I'd keep it to 5g if you are using it on a regular basis.
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Old 09-21-09, 06:52 AM
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Why do people keep recommending soy and whey protien, hemp protein is healthier, taste better and its loaded with all kinds of good stuff. Soy contains a ****load of phyto estrogens which totally mess with mens hormones (ever wondered why we have so many metrosexuals, gays etc.). Whey comes from cow milk that is designed for baby calfs that need to gain 500 pounds...
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Old 09-21-09, 11:11 AM
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Taste is subjective, but people might prefer whey due to its higher protein density and lack of carbohydrates.
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Old 09-21-09, 04:30 PM
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Originally Posted by hemprider View Post
Why do people keep recommending soy and whey protien, hemp protein is healthier, taste better and its loaded with all kinds of good stuff. Soy contains a ****load of phyto estrogens which totally mess with mens hormones (ever wondered why we have so many metrosexuals, gays etc.). Whey comes from cow milk that is designed for baby calfs that need to gain 500 pounds...
LOL at the Soy protein comment....Hemp is a good protein powder, but whey isolate is also good. And Hemp Rider is correct soy protein is the worst.
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Old 09-21-09, 05:12 PM
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Originally Posted by hemprider View Post
Why do people keep recommending soy and whey protien, hemp protein is healthier, taste better and its loaded with all kinds of good stuff. Soy contains a ****load of phyto estrogens which totally mess with mens hormones (ever wondered why we have so many metrosexuals, gays etc.). Whey comes from cow milk that is designed for baby calfs that need to gain 500 pounds...
There are many reasons for whey such as mixability and taste (bland enough to be flavored into just about anything). Where hemp really does fall short is in speed of digestion and bioavailability. Hemp's fiber and desireable fatty acid profile also means that it is more slowly digested, which is good for a morning smoothie, but not idea for immediately after a ride. Bioavailability is how completely the protein is absorbed. While hemp isn't bad (about 50-60) whey is the best (100+).
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Old 09-21-09, 05:53 PM
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Originally Posted by WhiskeySmack View Post
Or should I just focus on riding a lot and eating healthy?
I have spent the last 15 months on a weight loss plan and lost 93lb so far, if you want to lose weight you need to focus on that.
In another 7lbs i will switch to maintenance mode and start building muscle
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Old 09-22-09, 11:30 AM
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Originally Posted by dsotm View Post
Be careful! The most I have ever heard recommended for a single serving of creatine is 10g and that is only during the loading phase. I'd keep it to 5g if you are using it on a regular basis.
opps, you caught me there. I only take a 5g serving.
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