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Old 12-30-12, 12:08 PM
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Nutrition

I have been gaining some weight over the holidays, and I want to take it off for the new year for a couple of reasons. (1) To become a better cyclist (2) It would be nice to see an increase in speeed/climbing ability (I believe this is my strength) (3) For overall health, you can never go wrong with that. I want to drop about 5lbs from my average weight in the season, and was thinking of a few things that may be holding me back.

I eat A LOT of bread, it is my favourite food, but I hear of people always giving up bread because of gluten, because it's unhealthy and has fats in it? I wouldn't give bread up completely, but can definitely not eat as much as I do now.

Also, I have coffee a lot, mostly at night around 8-10pm, I've never really been able to get a good, early night sleep, should I cut back on the coffee at night to get some more sleep? Or will that just be pointless?

Thanks.
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Old 12-30-12, 12:28 PM
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Yes, cut down on the bread, and cut the coffee at night. Substitute a raw vegetable or fruit for the bread.

As an aside, do you have sugar or creamer in the coffee?
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Old 12-30-12, 12:50 PM
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I think you answered your own question with the coffee. I'd switch to decaf, because you still get taste but none of the caffeine. I eat a lot of bread too but that's because I'm a vegetarian and that's how I justify the carbs I eat
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Old 12-30-12, 01:04 PM
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1. Don't drink your calories.

2. Meticulously count your calories. Use a program like FitDay or Daily Plate or even Nutrition Data to count everything you eat. You may be surprised where your calories are.


I find that if I meticulously count my calories for 3 weeks, if I assume that my daily calorie expenditure is 1500 calories with no exercise, if I assume that 1 hour of walking = 250 calories and 1 hour on the bicycle is 500 calories, and based on those assumptions, if I aim to consume 500 calories less than what I burn ... during those 3 weeks, I can lose 5-6 lbs.
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Old 12-30-12, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Rowan View Post
Yes, cut down on the bread, and cut the coffee at night. Substitute a raw vegetable or fruit for the bread.

As an aside, do you have sugar or creamer in the coffee?
Sounds good, and yes, I have some cream (approx. 1 - we just pour it by hand), and one spoon of sugar (not heeping).

Originally Posted by atallen223 View Post
I think you answered your own question with the coffee. I'd switch to decaf, because you still get taste but none of the caffeine. I eat a lot of bread too but that's because I'm a vegetarian and that's how I justify the carbs I eat
Is decaf a special type you have to buy? Or just without the sugar or cream?

Originally Posted by Machka View Post
1. Don't drink your calories.

2. Meticulously count your calories. Use a program like FitDay or Daily Plate or even Nutrition Data to count everything you eat. You may be surprised where your calories are.


I find that if I meticulously count my calories for 3 weeks, if I assume that my daily calorie expenditure is 1500 calories with no exercise, if I assume that 1 hour of walking = 250 calories and 1 hour on the bicycle is 500 calories, and based on those assumptions, if I aim to consume 500 calories less than what I burn ... during those 3 weeks, I can lose 5-6 lbs.
Thanks, I'll check those out. I did 75 minutes of 10x3 min at 110% FTP intervals with 5min rest between each one yesterday, and not burned a little over 800 calories.. 1100 including warm up/cool down. Is that a lot? Or is it just because I'm already a skinny guy? I consumed about 500 calories prior to and during that ride (combined).
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Old 12-30-12, 01:38 PM
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Originally Posted by sstang13 View Post
Sounds good, and yes, I have some cream (approx. 1 - we just pour it by hand), and one spoon of sugar (not heeping).
Cut out the creamer and sugar. They are calories, and they build up over the day with each coffee you have. You can keep the sweetness by using a substitute, but look carefully at the contents -- I've noticed that a few use maltodextrin or similar as a filler, and that constitutes calories.

Originally Posted by sstang13 View Post
Is decaf a special type you have to buy? Or just without the sugar or cream?
Decaf coffee. Brew or make it the same as regular coffee.
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Old 12-30-12, 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by sstang13 View Post
Is decaf a special type you have to buy? Or just without the sugar or cream?

Decaf ... Decaffeinated. No caffeine. Have you never heard of coffee with no caffeine?

Yes, do check out the calorie counting sites ... they'll probably be quite informative for you. Have a good look at Nutrition Data too.
https://nutritiondata.self.com/




Originally Posted by sstang13 View Post
I did 75 minutes of 10x3 min at 110% FTP intervals with 5min rest between each one yesterday, and not burned a little over 800 calories.. 1100 including warm up/cool down. Is that a lot? Or is it just because I'm already a skinny guy? I consumed about 500 calories prior to and during that ride (combined).
Most computer calorie counters estimate high. Instead, assume you burned 500-600 calories per hour ... especially if you want to lose weight. So in 75 minutes you might have burned 625 to 750 calories. Add that to the 1500 calories it takes to keep you alive, and you'll have burned approx. 2100-2200 calories yesterday. So if you want to lose weight, consume no more than 1700 calories for the whole day.
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Old 12-30-12, 04:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Machka View Post
Decaf ... Decaffeinated. No caffeine. Have you never heard of coffee with no caffeine?

Yes, do check out the calorie counting sites ... they'll probably be quite informative for you. Have a good look at Nutrition Data too.
https://nutritiondata.self.com/






Most computer calorie counters estimate high. Instead, assume you burned 500-600 calories per hour ... especially if you want to lose weight. So in 75 minutes you might have burned 625 to 750 calories. Add that to the 1500 calories it takes to keep you alive, and you'll have burned approx. 2100-2200 calories yesterday. So if you want to lose weight, consume no more than 1700 calories for the whole day.
Yes I've heard of it before.. Just don't know if some of the calories would come from the sugar/cream or not.
That calorie counting is way to confusing for me, I'll just cut out some of the coffee/bread intake
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Old 12-30-12, 05:23 PM
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Counting calories isn't going to do much if you're eating crap. Ditch the sugar, cream, and bread. Plain black coffee is fine. Your whole diet is likely a wreck.

Originally Posted by atallen223 View Post
I eat a lot of bread too but that's because I'm a vegetarian and that's how I justify the carbs I eat
Fruits and vegetables are mainly carbohydrates, so that doesn't make any sense. You, a vegetarian, should be more worried about many other things than getting enough carbs.
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Old 12-30-12, 08:49 PM
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Originally Posted by sstang13 View Post
Yes I've heard of it before.. Just don't know if some of the calories would come from the sugar/cream or not.
That calorie counting is way to confusing for me, I'll just cut out some of the coffee/bread intake
Counting calories is not confusing. And it sounds like it is something you urgently need to do if you don't know if calories would come from sugar and cream!!

Coffee, black (2 calories): https://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/beverages/3898/2

Coffee, black decaf (0 calories): https://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/beverages/3894/2

Sugar, one teaspoon (16.3 calories): https://www.fitday.com/foods/s-fndds2...d-or-lump.html

Cream, one tablespoon (29 calories): https://caloriecount.about.com/calori...ize_grams=15.0


If you have a lot of coffee, as you said in your original post, and if "a lot" means 6 cups a day ... and if you're a two teaspoon of sugar + one tablespoon of cream per cup of coffee type of person ... that means you're consuming 195.6 calories of sugar, and 174 calories of cream = 369.6 calories in your coffee thoughout the day.

If you're trying to limit yourself to 1700 calories so that you can lose weight, 369.6 calories is almost 22% of your calories. You're left with about 1330 calories to try to use for decent meals, and that's not much.

Cut out the sugar and cream ... and drink black coffee (either regular or decaf) and you've got your whole 1700 calories to work with each day ... you'll be able to eat a reasonable amount of decent food.
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Old 12-30-12, 10:18 PM
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Switching to decaf is so you can sleep properly. If you are training hard you need to sleep well.

Don't switch all at once. Most people will go through caffeine withdrawl (headaches, feeling like crap) if they do that. Buy some decaf coffee and start out mixing it half and half with the caffeinated coffee. Once you're used to that do 1/4 caffeinated. When you are used to that, then go all decaf. One benefit of not consuming caffeine every day is that caffeinated gels have more of an effect. But you need to save them for when you really need the boost and use non caffeinated gels the rest of the time.


For losing weight: I hate counting calories, and it is especially difficult if you make food from scratch rather than eating packaged food. So when I want to lose weight I just cut back. Cutting out empty calories (soda, sugar in coffee, etc) is the easiest. I've already done that so to lose weight I cut down on the amount of food I eat, mostly at dinner. That way it doesn't impact my fueling for training and recovery as I train in the morning.
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Old 12-30-12, 10:42 PM
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To add to what others said - remember that counting calories is an approximation of how your body functions and should only be used as a guide. Yes, it can be helpful to get a gauge on how much you're eating and surprpise areas where you can cut back, but don't go too overboard.

I'd say use calories to get initial baseline of steady weight loss, and then ween off of it once you get used to it / lose the desired amount. Also make sure you're not feeling like crap or losing too much weight, now matter what the "calories" are saying - our bodies are not 1:1 closed systems.



Originally Posted by sstang13 View Post
I eat A LOT of bread, it is my favourite food, but I hear of people always giving up bread because of gluten, because it's unhealthy and has fats in it?
There is nothing wrong with bread, millenia of numerous bread-based cultures can attest to that. A proper sandwich is like the ultimate food - whole wheat grains, veggies, protein and some fat. Covers all your body's needs. Just make sure you use balanced ingredients and don't bathe the loaf in mayo. I eat bread literally every day (comes with being Polish) and has been consistently losing weight.

Also keep in mind I am talking about properly baked, nutrient-rich, and balanced bread, not the synthetic, HFCS-infused and processed-to-all-hell white sponge you get at Safeway.
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Old 12-30-12, 10:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Machka View Post
Counting calories is not confusing. And it sounds like it is something you urgently need to do if you don't know if calories would come from sugar and cream!!

Coffee, black (2 calories): https://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/beverages/3898/2

Coffee, black decaf (0 calories): https://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/beverages/3894/2

Sugar, one teaspoon (16.3 calories): https://www.fitday.com/foods/s-fndds2...d-or-lump.html

Cream, one tablespoon (29 calories): https://caloriecount.about.com/calori...ize_grams=15.0


If you have a lot of coffee, as you said in your original post, and if "a lot" means 6 cups a day ... and if you're a two teaspoon of sugar + one tablespoon of cream per cup of coffee type of person ... that means you're consuming 195.6 calories of sugar, and 174 calories of cream = 369.6 calories in your coffee thoughout the day.

If you're trying to limit yourself to 1700 calories so that you can lose weight, 369.6 calories is almost 22% of your calories. You're left with about 1330 calories to try to use for decent meals, and that's not much.

Cut out the sugar and cream ... and drink black coffee (either regular or decaf) and you've got your whole 1700 calories to work with each day ... you'll be able to eat a reasonable amount of decent food.
I meant the counting you were doing earlier, just hard to wrap my head around.. as you can probably tell I'm no nurtrition or math freak..

Darn, sorry I should of specified.. I only drink one cup ever night, sometimes I'll have one in the morning when I can. It just feels like a lot because it feels like every night I have it, it sets me back a little more in sleeping.. But I won't know for sure because I can't sleep nights even when I decide not to have one. Anyway, I see 1700 calories is the mark to hit, so I'll just use the links above to count the calories I eat each day, see where I'm at, and adjust.

I didn't think coffee would be so low in calories, that's great because I love to eat and it's very hard to not eat something when I'm craving it, I'm sure you know what I mean Thanks.

Originally Posted by ericm979 View Post
Switching to decaf is so you can sleep properly. If you are training hard you need to sleep well.

Don't switch all at once. Most people will go through caffeine withdrawl (headaches, feeling like crap) if they do that. Buy some decaf coffee and start out mixing it half and half with the caffeinated coffee. Once you're used to that do 1/4 caffeinated. When you are used to that, then go all decaf. One benefit of not consuming caffeine every day is that caffeinated gels have more of an effect. But you need to save them for when you really need the boost and use non caffeinated gels the rest of the time.


For losing weight: I hate counting calories, and it is especially difficult if you make food from scratch rather than eating packaged food. So when I want to lose weight I just cut back. Cutting out empty calories (soda, sugar in coffee, etc) is the easiest. I've already done that so to lose weight I cut down on the amount of food I eat, mostly at dinner. That way it doesn't impact my fueling for training and recovery as I train in the morning.
Ya, we have quite a bit of homemade food in my house. The most pop I drink is maybe a glass of wine and gingerale at supper, but that's not even enough to think about it. Sometimes I'll have a coke for energy but again, it's pretty rare. Good advice for switching to decaf as well
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Old 12-30-12, 11:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Koobazaur View Post
To add to what others said - remember that counting calories is an approximation of how your body functions and should only be used as a guide. Yes, it can be helpful to get a gauge on how much you're eating and surprpise areas where you can cut back, but don't go too overboard.

I'd say use calories to get initial baseline of steady weight loss, and then ween off of it once you get used to it / lose the desired amount. Also make sure you're not feeling like crap or losing too much weight, now matter what the "calories" are saying - our bodies are not 1:1 closed systems.





There is nothing wrong with bread, millenia of numerous bread-based cultures can attest to that. A proper sandwich is like the ultimate food - whole wheat grains, veggies, protein and some fat. Covers all your body's needs. Just make sure you use balanced ingredients and don't bathe the loaf in mayo. I eat bread literally every day (comes with being Polish) and has been consistently losing weight.

Also keep in mind I am talking about properly baked, nutrient-rich, and balanced bread, not the synthetic, HFCS-infused and processed-to-all-hell white sponge you get at Safeway.
I won't be going overboard with losing weight, that's for sure, but I just want to lose a few pounds for reason I stated in my original post.

And yes, being italian, we eat everything with bread (not literally). I get my bread from a local bakery, but I can never say for sure what they do/don't put in it of course.
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Old 12-30-12, 11:11 PM
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Originally Posted by ericm979 View Post
For losing weight: I hate counting calories, and it is especially difficult if you make food from scratch rather than eating packaged food.
The longest I can keep it up for is about 3 weeks. After that it becomes a pain. But it is a good way to see where my calories are coming from. Many of the calorie counting sites also include other nutritional information about the foods we eat so I can also see my vitamin and mineral intake, etc.

After about 3 weeks, I have a pretty good idea what's working and just keep going from there. In May 2011, I started counting, then a couple weeks later stopped counting but kept up a better diet for the next 11 weeks. In 13 weeks, I lost 13 lbs. But counting calories kick starts it for me.

(And when we get back to Australia, I'm going to have to start counting again. )
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Old 12-31-12, 11:06 AM
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If bread doesn't give you the runs, don't give it up. It's good food. Locally baked bread is wonderful.

I don't drink coffee after 2pm, but I'll have drunk a quart by then. I don't see any utility in decaf. Why does it even exist? If you want a hot drink, use herb tea. You can buy it in bulk so it's almost free.

You can combine riding more with portion control. For some reason, riding more seems to reduce my appetite if I keep my portion sizes down. I need to eat something after riding, but it doesn't have to be much. If I'm hungry at bedtime, I'll eat an ounce of cheese or 15g whey protein, no carbs. Try to get your head around to where that empty feeling is a good feeling. Positive reinforcement will be weight loss. OTOH, you do that too much and you'll lose power on the bike. If that happens, you need to eat a little more.
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Old 12-31-12, 03:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy View Post
If bread doesn't give you the runs, don't give it up. It's good food. Locally baked bread is wonderful.

I don't drink coffee after 2pm, but I'll have drunk a quart by then. I don't see any utility in decaf. Why does it even exist? If you want a hot drink, use herb tea. You can buy it in bulk so it's almost free.

You can combine riding more with portion control. For some reason, riding more seems to reduce my appetite if I keep my portion sizes down. I need to eat something after riding, but it doesn't have to be much. If I'm hungry at bedtime, I'll eat an ounce of cheese or 15g whey protein, no carbs. Try to get your head around to where that empty feeling is a good feeling. Positive reinforcement will be weight loss. OTOH, you do that too much and you'll lose power on the bike. If that happens, you need to eat a little more.
I like that first sentence.. I do like my bread

Mostly I guess because I drink my coffee at night instead of mornings, so it keeps me up at the wrong time..

When I ride, I get hungry. And when I eat, I get thirsty, when I drink, I get hungry. It's a viscious circle.
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Old 12-31-12, 03:52 PM
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If you ride 2 hours or less, it is important to drink (water) but you probably don't need to eat much ... provided you're eating a reasonable amount throughout the day.

If you ride 2 hours or more, then eating becomes more important.
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Old 12-31-12, 04:01 PM
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Originally Posted by sstang13 View Post
I like that first sentence.. I do like my bread

Mostly I guess because I drink my coffee at night instead of mornings, so it keeps me up at the wrong time..

When I ride, I get hungry. And when I eat, I get thirsty, when I drink, I get hungry. It's a viscious circle.
Just how much bread are you eating each day? You mentioned on several occasions that you love bread, and that leads me to think that along with your sugar and cream intake from coffee, that the cumulative effect of the calories from bread is significant.
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Old 01-01-13, 04:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Machka View Post
If you ride 2 hours or less, it is important to drink (water) but you probably don't need to eat much ... provided you're eating a reasonable amount throughout the day.

If you ride 2 hours or more, then eating becomes more important.
Ya, most of my rides are all around 2-2.5 hours long, and I find that I can ride as hard as I can without food, but once I reach that 3 hour mark on longer rides, my energy levels drop and all I need is a small granola bar (nutri-grain bar) to get back to high energy level.

Originally Posted by Rowan View Post
Just how much bread are you eating each day? You mentioned on several occasions that you love bread, and that leads me to think that along with your sugar and cream intake from coffee, that the cumulative effect of the calories from bread is significant.
Well sometimes I'll have two pieces of toast, or just a sandwich with english bread (2 slices each way), but not everyday, just somedays if I feel like it. Then at supper time, we have paninis, and I'll have anywhere from half of one, to usually about 1-1.5. I'll usually just finish all the left over bread which on most days ends up being 1-2 paninis.
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Old 01-01-13, 10:07 PM
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Try to use less amount of cream in your food and try to eat more and more vegetables Dont use oily things and avoid using food which contains healthy amount of fats in it Try to do a little exercise to strengthen you muscles and to increase your stamina.

Last edited by dylan33; 09-18-14 at 03:36 AM.
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Old 01-02-13, 01:10 AM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy View Post
If I'm hungry at bedtime, I'll eat an ounce of cheese or 15g whey protein, no carbs.
Hasn't the whole "carbs at night = FAT" been disproved already? I have like a bowl of oatmeal before bed on regular basis and no chance in hell I'm giving that up. Not that I need to...
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Old 01-02-13, 01:38 AM
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My 80 year old neighbor provided me the most EPIC weight loss ever.... actually its more like the best colon cleaner ever & as you probably have heard, your colon is about 23 meters of fiber holding dead weight!

For less than $2 eat nothing but cabbage soup & liquids (tomato soup can be considered a liquid drink). Now first warning Mama Margie gave me was not to stay on this diet for more than two (2) weeks because it has absolutely no nutritional value. However, it really really works!!!! Just be prepared because it is going to clean out that 23 meters of pooh shooter you got going on there, which is where the weight loss comes in... smelly work I kid you not!

I cut up & boil cabbage (normal size head is about $0.50) in either boullion (chicken, beef or tomato) or lipton onion to taste (the ramen packages are not too bad but really REALLY high on sodium ~ Not Good!)

Oddly filling, giving you supple skin & you can eat as much as you like, but stay close to the facilities because it starts working in less than a few hours of digestion. Cabbage is the base of most of the Asian countries dishes I have been exposed to & now I know why asians can stay soooo darn thin! It's the Cabbage in the Kimchi!

For me, extra sleep also worked well when I started weight lifting several years ago... Weight lifting increases your muscularity (good for biking) and also demands more fuel to power (sucking out those fat reserves). As your muscles grow, keep in mind muscles weigh more, so if you use a scale, this is going to lie to you eventually. Use either a calipur or a tape measure to compare your progress day by day.

Coffee after 11 years on graveyard shift has never kept me up. When I am tired, I fall asleep, but if you have trouble falling asleep, exercise should help tire you out. Actually, I like to run, lift or cycle when I am hungry.. Then I consume more water and less food & water has way less calories & good for the skin!

If you get a chance go see my high school favorite www.scoobysworkshop.com He rocks at the math when getting off the cabbage & back on real food.... Just make sure you keep everything at his 10% or under rule (Calories from Fat/Total Calories) and you will maintain instead of loose ground. Forget the fitness centers, its like the lines in the military, hurry up & wait! Much better to spend that time on your bike and use a few dumbbells/barbells/situp bench tools (I got all that off craig's list for under $50.

Good Luck & don't forget to privately chart your progress so you can visually see your rewarded daily efforts! Happy New Year!
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Old 01-02-13, 01:40 AM
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Oh my that was wordy! Sorry! #.#
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Old 01-02-13, 02:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Koobazaur View Post
Hasn't the whole "carbs at night = FAT" been disproved already? I have like a bowl of oatmeal before bed on regular basis and no chance in hell I'm giving that up. Not that I need to...
Carbs can help in releasing tryptophan and serotonin which can help in relaxing you into sleep.

The melatonin in oatmeal also helps you get to sleep. Dried cherries and bananas also contain enough melatonin to help. Iíll often have a cut up banana for a late night snack before I go to bed.

Enjoy your oatmeal and maybe put a few dried cherries in it
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