FBOATSB

I read a lot on these forums about proper nutrition, most people here have a quite good grasp of the subject, What do you consider to be junk food and what do you consider to be super food? Steamed broccoli good? Add butter and salt/pepper junk? What say you.

FBOATSB

Air popped corn-good. Drizzled with coconut oil and butter and garlic salt-bad?

wolfchild

Real dairy butter is NOT junk food !! , it's very wholesome and nutritious food....Margarine and vegetable shortening is the real junk food.

wolfchild

Any type of meat substitute or dairy substitute such as tofu hot dogs, soy burgers, soy ice cream, soy butter, soy milk are also junk food.

Tabagas_Ru

IMO junk food is nutrient poor and calorie rich. Just about any food item with an ingredient list and more often than not it's calories are carbs. It can also be contextual.

A superfood is a BS term used to sell people real food, and pills that contain parts of real foods.

Machka 

IMO, junk food is very contextual and also changes with the times.


I have read books written in the 1950s (fiction books) where the teenagers go out for hamburgers and pizza ... and their parents called that junk food. And yet, a good hamburger or pizza can contain all the elements of a healthy well-balanced meal.


Potato chips, eaten while sitting on the sofa in front of the TV might be junk food. But when they are eaten at the 100K point of a hot 200K, they are an excellent source of electrolytes and fuel.

Ice cream every evening after dinner might be junk food ... but it is another thing which goes down really well in the middle of a long, hot ride. Ice cream has fat and carbs ... good source of fuel ... and ice cream is cold which often hits the spot, and for many people, ice cream sits quite well.

A lemonade icy pole is mostly frozen sugar water. Probably close to a perfect description of junk food. And yet, when I came out of surgery yesterday, and was struggling with nausea from the anesthetic, I was given an lemonade icy pole to nibble on. Ice goes down better and sits better than plain water, and they wanted me to get a bit of sugar in. Just a few simple calories would also help settle my stomach. And I have to say it was indeed just the thing at that moment.
Icy Pole | Peters Ice Cream


And broccoli ... if it has had the life boiled out of it and is smothered in a cheese-flavoured sauce ... could become junk food.

GeorgeBMac

Yes -- without getting too tangled up in the details and specifics -- Yes!

The human body has an incredible ability to utilize many different nutrients -- and sometimes, under some conditions, it needs some more than others. What is a junk food under most conditions becomes a valuable nutrient under other conditions -- perhaps not the BEST nutrient, but a nutrient none the less.

Is eating a table spoon of refined sugar good for you? Most would agree not. But, if you are staggering from hypoglycemia, it becomes a very valuable nutrient -- one that quite literally could be life saving...

FBOATSB

Thanks. We only use real butter and make our own "margarine" of equal parts EVOO and butter.

chasm54

No, not true. There's nothing wrong with soy "milk", for example. It doesn't have the calcium or B vitamins of cows milk, but it is a good protein source.

In general I wouldn't substitute soy for meat or dairy but soybeans are nutritious, it's eccentric to dismiss them as "junk".

FBOATSB

Aaah, Quiescently frozen sugar water, or a popsicle here, is wonderful on a hot summer day but I must be supervised closely because of my lack of willpower. In my opinion it is all about portion control. I hope your surgery went well.

FBOATSB

We keep soy milk for cold cereal, coconut milk creamer, or half & half for coffee, all good. Many people can't tolerate dairy. Milk that is, or a great big bowl of ice cream!

Number400

Junk food is anything that you eat instead of eating real food. In my opinion, junk food is perfectly fine on top of/in addition to wholesome foods if weight is not an issue :-)

wolfchild

I do use cliff bars which contain soy and I also use fermented soy sauce in small amounts as seasoning for food. But other then those two things I don't use any other soy products.

Machka 

Soy comes from soybeans. It's a legume, and comes from the family which includes soybeans, peas, green beans and shelling beans, as well as peanuts, lentils, chickpeas, lupines, alfalfa and clover.
What Plant Family Do Soybeans Come From? | Home Guides | SF Gate

It's also contains all the essential amino acids, so it is a complete protein ... a rather unique feature among plants.

My first exposure to soy beans was as a snack in the late 70s or early 80s ... roasted and salted. They were great! And a good source of protein, several minerals, and a few vitamins. We didn't eat a lot of them in one go because they were quite filling, and I seem to recall that we often had them in a mix with pumpkin seeds and sunflower seeds.
Nutrition Facts and Analysis for Soybeans, mature seeds, roasted, salted


And although soybean products aren't widely used in North America, they are more commonly used in Asia.

I wouldn't soybeans "junk food" anymore than I would call chickpeas or peanuts "junk food".

FBOATSB

Tempeh and edamame is also quite tasty.

nkfrench

As a side note about the 1950's pizza and hamburgers being "junk food" - those foods have changed a lot over the years and what we eat today bears little resemblance to what I was served when I was growing up.
The restaurant hamburgers were much smaller, similar to a child/junior serving. They had tiny portions of greasy meat on a bun without the lettuce and tomato common today.

The pizza was often just a thin white flour crust smeared with a little tomato sauce and a few sprinkles of parmesan cheese. Maybe some sausage or pepperoni. I had never heard of a vegetable pizza back then.

The criticism was that these foods were expensive and eaten instead of mom's cooking that included vegetables and more protein. Besides, parents have always found something to complain about with teenagers.

nkfrench

Junk food is what your friends and family eat that you disapprove of. Or what your guilty pleasures are. As Machka states, context is important.

I consider bacon to be a junk food - more of a high-calorie flavoring agent than a source of protein. Your opinion may vary.

But ice cream, hmm. When I was swimming in all-day meets, I found that a bowl of ice cream for breakfast chased with coffee -- a couple of hours ahead -- worked well. Enough caffeine and sugar to get me perked up and moving; enough fat to slow digestion to avoid sugar crashes, low-volume so I could do tight flipturns or streamline without having a big stomach. It provided energy for a long time when you don't have time to eat between events and are burning a lot of calories both from swimming and from trying to maintain body temperature in chilly conditions.

Gyrine

Well OP, the above posts certainly shoot a huge hole in your presumption that most people on this forum have a good grasp of proper nutrition.

GeorgeBMac

...Heavy Sigh...

If THIS group doesn't have a concept of healthy nutrition ( or care about it) then, is there any hope for this world -- except for more heart disease, cancer, diabetes and Alzheimer's?

Meanwhile, treating those diseases accounts for 75-80% of health care spending in the U.S. -- and health care spending is not only driving this country a little crazy, but driving it into bankruptcy... We simply cannot afford the lifestyles we lead...

Now, if you will excuse me, I'm going to go buy some stocks or ETF's in our DiseaseCare industry.
... You guys are going to make me rich!
....... Anybody want a statin to go with that "healthy" food you are eating?

[The JunkFood / ProcessedFood / FastFood industries have convinced this country that their toxins are normal and healthy...]

nkfrench

If somebody has hypoglycemia and is on the verge of passing out, a packet of table sugar (highly portable, cheap, available, doesn't spoil, immediate effect) is bad?
Or when you are dehydrated and nauseated, eat something that likely will be vomited that will worsen your condition? Flat 7-up and saltine crackers are easily tolerated.
Popsicles (icy poles to some of you) are commonly fed post-op.
When my cat had a stomach virus, her vet instructed me to feed her plain vanilla ice cream until she felt better.

I don't think anyone is advocating popsicles or soda/pop/colas/soft drinks or potato chips or ice cream as a large part of the daily normal diet especially if caloric needs are low-to-moderate.

Context.
And moderation.

Machka 

+1

Absolutely!

GeorgeBMac

Rather mixed messages...

Yes, if you are starving or dying of thirst, a toxin can save your life. But that does not make it any less of a toxin.

That is the essential issue with the reductionists where an (often) industry funded researcher proves a minor point in some laboratory type experiment under highly limited and controlled circumstances -- and then proclaims that a toxin is really a health food...

Or: 'anything/everything in moderation'...
Or: 'There are no 'bad' calories...'
... Here little boy, try this [________]... a little bit won't hurt you...

Meanwhile, with near epidemics of chronic diseases pervading the industrialized world, SOMETHING is very much hurting us... Today, over-weight and obesity is more "normal" than what used to be considered "normal weight" and, chronic diseases are believed to be an inevitable and normal part of aging...
... "Why can't you tie your shoe laces?"
...... "Oh, I'm just getting old..."
... "No, you're just getting FAT!"

p.s.
From the journals of Lazarus Long:
"If tempted by something that feels 'altruistic', examine your motives and root out that self deception. Then, if you still want to do it, wallow in it!"

Perhaps we could adapt that to this conversation by replacing 'something that feels altruistic' with 'a toxin that tastes good'

Machka 

I think the human body is more resilient than that ... I think that if I eat a small bag of potato chips once every couple months in the middle of a long ride, thus replenishing my electrolytes and providing me with the energy to finish the ride, my body can take those nutrients and deal with them appropriately.

However, if I ate a small bag of potato chips every single day, or with every meal ... that could be a different story.

I am, and will remain, of the belief that context and moderation are the way to go. It is when moderation becomes overindulgence that the issues begin.



BTW - sugar, for example, is not a toxin. Neither are electrolytes. Potatoes aren't a toxin. Neither is milk ... or cream.

GeorgeBMac

I think it was John McDougall who said:
"If you bang your shin on a coffee table, it will heal. If you bang it on the coffee table 3 times a day, everyday..."

I agree... Once we stop poisoning it, the body has a remarkable ability to heal itself.

But eating a toxin only sporadically does not turn it into something any less toxic.

But, I admit everybody does it -- including me.
- If I am out and very hungry I might stop and buy something that I would not otherwise want to put into my mouth.
- Or, if I'm on a ride and I bonk, I might stop and buy some sugary treat just to get me home.
- Or, if I am at a friend's and he serves something I recognize as not healthy, I will probably eat some.
- Or, sometimes I simply just fall to temptation. Last night, going through Whole Foods, I very nearly picked up that donut they had in the case by the checkout. It looked SO good!

But, when I do, I do it with the full understanding that I am banging my shin against the coffee table...
... It must be my Catholic upbringing: perpetual guilt!

Machka 

Happily ... I know that the cheesecake in my fridge, which I made on the weekend, is not toxic, and that if I have a slice of it, I'm not going to harm myself. I know that my body is capable of handling the slice of cheesecake just fine.

I also know that if I ate a whole cheesecake every day, I might harm myself ... for one thing, I would start packing on the weight ... so I don't do that.

It's all about moderation.


[HR][/HR]

I will also add that I know there are some people who have to be really strict about their diets. They can't just have one small packet of chips ... and then not touch chips again for the next 3 months. They are the sort that once they start eating, they just keep going. They are the sort who hear someone in the office open a packet of chips ... and they've got to have one too. They are the ones who cannot walk down the aisle of chips in the grocery store without grabbing several packets.

The advice given to those people is:
-- don't keep it (whatever the favourite junk food is) in the house
-- keep something healthy in your desk so that when your coworker starts munching, you can fill up on your healthy food
-- eat something healthy before you go shopping, and avoid your trigger aisles.

Not bad advice for the rest of us as well to ensure that we keep the junk food consumption down to moderate levels.