Oh, and look at that.....it's your first and only post. In the Kestrel thread, and directed at me.

Shill or ******bag, it's all the same.

Tried to help you and you took the low road ... some people never learn ... :thumb:

It's not like LBS don't discount. I bought my wife's Trek from a local shop for a price that I doubt BD would have been willing to offer.

I appreciate Playpius honesty. What I hate on the forum is the bike dealers making up stories about BD. Usually they heard from a friend.

I think it is a difficult situation. In the last year I purchased one bike online and one bike from LBS. Motobecane online and a Cervelo P2C from LBS. I use my LBS for things I need quickly and for some bike work. Most work I do myself.

We need LBS. But can they survive with the situation? I don't think anyone that owns a LBS is making much money. Most do it for the love.

For things like wheels I always purchase online. Powertap, etc. The LBS even with my special relationship can not even come close to the price.

I am looking at buying a new bike for my birthday. It is really hard to pass up some of the deals out there. The Kestrel RT700 is a lot of bang for the buck. You can buy from several online dealers.

While i understand platypus' issues about online sellers, platypus' also disclosed the employee cost of cervelo's on another thread. to me this is the pot callin the kettle black in a way cause now that i know what a dealer might pay for a cervelo now i want to pay that much for the next one and demand my dealer take less on the bike as i know there is 100% markup....... hmmm

You know I was reading PlatyPius' response, I don't think he said anything against the free market. If you are a retailer, you need to funnel your business to those wholesalers that benefit you and your customers the most. I'm not in the bicycle business, but it's just common business sense. If you as a wholesaler are going to after other markets, you need to take into account that it may hurt relationships in the markets you are currently in. But there's nothing immature about doing what's best for your business and customers. If enough LBS's funnel their business to wholesalers that meet their needs, prices will drop and they'll be competitive. That's just how it works.

Completely different.

I'll tell customers how much we paid for the bikes we sell too, if they ask. Reasonable people understand that we're here to make money as well as provide people with bikes and service. If someone wants to buy bikes and parts at cost, they should work at a bike shop.

I know that furniture stores sell sofas and such at 400%+ markup. I still buy my furniture at a store rather than online.

I know that my insurance is higher because I have an agent. I like my agent. I like the added value he gives to my insurance. I accept the higher cost.

I know that diamond prices are artificially inflated and that jewelers mark diamond jewelery up quite a bit (I used to set stones and create jewelery at one time also.) That didn't stop me from buying diamonds from a local jeweler when I got married. I didn't haggle, either. I paid the price asked. In return, my wife's rings are serviced (cleaned, replated if needed [white gold], sized, etc) for life.

I know that the brake rotor for my Toyota costs the parts store $18.00 while it costs me $35.00. I don't try to negotiate the price. I like having a parts store 2 blocks from me. I don't want to have to order it online and wait for it to be delivered.

Anyway..... I'm rambling again.

Kestrel Question
 

Why sizing differences in various models?....specifically I am normally a 56 (only 5'10 short legs 29 inseam but very long body - the 56 feels more stable yet at first "they" always steer me to a 54) but in the Talon you offer 55 (or more odd numbers). I would guess that the 55 would be fine - just wondering why the odd sizing differences. Also, if have a choice between 700 and 800 modulus?? would you prefer 800?

I have plenty of road bikes, and my 2003 Talon is rarely ridden, but I'd like a quick tri-bike.

I could convert the Talon or get a tri-bike, but I see where some folks decry the geometry,
saying a converted road bike just looks like a tri-bike, whereas the tri-only are more stable.

I was turned on to Kestrel by a freaky fast Kestrel roadie, who says I shouldn't worry about it.
It's plenty stable as a roadie, with carbon bars, etc.

Will I lose some stability going to the forward seat post position and tt/tri bars?

Oh, and P.S. The Kestrels on BD are definitely hurting the sales of P2's and P3's around here. Bike shops here don't mind, because those buyers are almost all on line, anyway, until the bike comes in, then they come to LBS to get it right.

You will be fine. It's not as stable as a " tri bike" however the bike was designed with a slightly longer front center line and even with a forward body position on the bike, the Talon still is quite stable. If it was good enough for Macca, it's surely good enough for an age grouper.

hahahahaha you paid full price for jewelery, everything you say from now on is considered ******** to me. There is no going back from that one! I bet you pay full sticker price on vehicles too, I guess I should thank you for keeping our businesses in good shape. There's one born every second

you can't say r-e-t-a-r-d-e-d? that's ********

ha ha ha ha ha I'll bet you pay full price for produce wherever you buy it. There's one born every second.

WTF is your point?

You pride yourself in your ability to take money from other people's paychecks?
Bet it makes you feel good, doesn't it?

"Bob" at the bike shop, since he's the lowest on the totem pole, only gets to work 25 hours this week rather than 40 because a bunch of tight-arsed misers demanded discounts on everything. Now Bob has to either find another job, go on welfare, or start stealing from the McDonald's dumpster all because you cheap f##ks want to save 10%.

May I suggest the words: fellatio, aarvardk, and you? You can fill in the other words.

Kestrel? Never heard of the brand. Been makin' bikes long?

...not really diggin' the flash on the website either.

And how exactly did you try to 'help' PP? He put forth a very rational argument, supporting his post and you posted crap.

my point was, that if you pay full sticker price for jewelery then you didn't learn anything growing up. Oh and if "Bob" has the option of working at a bike shop or going dumpster diving I'd say grow up and get a real job, he's not in high school anymore.

So.... you'd rather shop at a bike shop staffed entirely by high school students?

Adults aren't allowed to work at a bike shop?

Guess I should get a real job....

(FWIW: I quit a job in IT to work in a bike shop again. I must REALLY be an idiot, eh?)

You certainly come across that way. This thread is about a manufacturer contact saying hi. Getting more manufacturer support on this forum is, I think, a real boon to the community. But then we have a buffoon like you come in and hijack the thread, turning it into a pricing rant. Start your own thread, if it's that important to you.


Kestrel Bicycle: welcome to the forums!

Mr. Warren it seems you have a reading comprehension problem.

Platy had an opportunity to bring his complaint to Kestrel Bicycles in a rational and professional manner. Instead, he chose to whine and rant.


I'm really not interested in side-lining this thread any more than it has been already. I have no questions or comments for Kestrel, so I'm going to bow out.

ummmm yeah I think your an idiot(i'm not alone on this assumption), if you think it takes half a brain to work in a bike shop and your proud of having that ability, then it's not my right to take that away from you. You act like your some kind of brain surgeon because you work on bikes.....BIKES. hahahaha not a skilled labor, no schooling needed, just common sense, but it seems even you have failed to provide that needed skill to fulfill your job. Maybe mcdonalds will be in your future, "would you like fries with that" practice that saying, because your gonna need it! I'm done with my rant, welcome to BF kestrel. You have some sharp bikes and I will be picking one up for next seasons triathlons.

Thanks for making it easy for me....

There's nothing better than someone calling me an idiot and misusing "your/you're".
See, my degree in English helped me with that. But I'm an idiot.
No skills.... Yeah, I.T. work requires no skill. Neither does web design. (2 years working for the state of Indiana.) Why am I justifying myself, though? I "work on bikes" (I'm actually the store manager) because I like it. I work at a bike shop because I enjoy putting people on new bikes that enable them to have some fun. I work at a bike shop because I like bringing new life into ratty old garage queens that get dragged into the shop.

But a tool like you wouldn't understand that.... you think only about dollar signs and "status" as exhibited by the job someone has. FWIW, the owner of this store was a teacher and coach. He quit so he could do something he enjoyed more. Is he an idiot too?

yes

Not to defend Platy, but you are showing complete ignorance in this response. Brain surgery is no different than working on a bike or car. It takes all the same abilities. You need to have good dexterity, troubleshooting skills and some brains. Just because it is required to complete 8yrs of college/med school and 4yrs of specialty internship makes not one a genius or even smart. It means that a particular person has an aptitude for it. I've met many a doctor or educated person who aren't much smarter than a McDonald's employee. I'm a former industry chemist and now a hs school teacher. I can wrench on bikes and cars. It takes quite a bit of aptitude to understand them or the world wouldn't have mechanics. A person who works at a job to pay the bills has a real job. Just because it doesn't pay much doesn't make it not real. I do something more important than any other job in this world other than parenting and farming, do I get paid a lot?

It seems to me that Kestrel hasn't answered a fair question to some of the posters. Why not? Flatsix911 isn't going to like the fact that VW is about to own the sports car side of Porsche. That may impede his future purchases.

I know this will come as a shock to people, but the dude IS a shill.....

http://www.bikeforums.net/search.php?searchid=6330845

Steve Harad,

There is something called random acts of kindness. My wife and I are lucky enough to make a good living. We have friends with a son on the Purdue Bike Racing Team. He has an old heavy bike but still finishes in the top 5 in all the races he enters. We want to buy him a carbon bike. I have been looking at the Talon, a nice bike with nice components for a 20 year old college kid. Do you think it would be a good bike for college racing? The price on Bikesdirect is good. Is the bottom bracket robust enough for a strong racer? Thanks.

Hi,

I ride a Kestrel RT700 which is the same frame as the RT800 and RT900. I weigh about 210 lbs. and am athletic. The Kestrel RT700 is the first bike that I can not flex bottom bracket at will. If I put all my weight on one pedal and jump hard, I can flex the bottom bracket to the side but I can do this on almost any bike.

While riding, I flex most wheels and never feel the frame flex...ever. I am really happy with the frame and don't think if a rider loses in a sprint or hill climb it will ever be because of the frame. Its stable on descents, tight on turns, and forgiving on long rides. It is slightly stiff on long 190km rides but that is also due to that distance is a bit too much for my pelvic area.

I hope my input has helped.

Is there a difference in the frame, between the 2009 RT800 and the 900? Seems I read something about the the team originally going to ride the RT900, but I'm guessing that the 800 with all Dura Ace 7900 is almost the same as the 900?

Just saw this, after I'd responded to an older post. How do you know the 3 have the same frame?
Hope you're right, at least about the RT900SL and the RT800SL, since I just ordered the latter, with all Dura Ace. The 900 got a great review at TestRider.com.

BTW, I think PlatyPius makes an excellent point about local dealers not being able to compete with online dealers who are able to offer discounts on the same bike. OTOH price protection can violate antitrust laws.

Bottom line for me, is that I think it's great for Kestrel to let me buy their bikes at a great discount from BD, as long as the local dealer can rely on the manufacturer/distributer to respond honestly to their inquiries about their practices before they buy.

If the consumer is willing to pay a premium for a name brand like Trek at the local dealer and get the personalized service of the LBS, fine. Other consumers are more price oriented and confident about setting up their bikes. Looks like a win win to me.

Cigars and other heavily taxed items are another matter all together. Our local cigar store went out of business because online consumers could buy cigars much cheaper than she could, because she had to pay Washington tobacco tax of about 75% on her wholesale cost, up front, then tack on an 8% sales tax on her retail price. She never had a chance.