where do I fit into this "Division" anyway?

I'm an agressive, 365'er, high mileage, vehicular cyclist that supports bike specific infrastructure for the benefits it brings a community, and recognizes a bicyclist can ride vehicularly in a lane classed for bike travel.

where am I sitting in this great, mischaracterized 'division?'

Good advice, even if you find it funny, but is that not what the 2 bad cops in Portland are ticketing cyclist for?

bad cops, more doughnuts. they give doughnuts out free in Portland to bicyclists one day a month, I've heard. maybe the cops are just jealous.

Could be, I will make sure we don't start handing out doughnuts in Hawaii.

you're soo anti-bicyclist :D, CB HI.

NO free doughnuts once a month? spoilsport.

It gets pushed to the side because legislators who live outside of the Portland area have not been willling to support it. We get a chance in this state to propose and pass new laws once every other year, and the groups who lobby in Salem for cycling concerns want to make change happen and they want the work they do down there to count for something. I think it's wise to push for the things they are likely to get before they go for the tough ones. It's not like there isn't dozens of useful changes to choose from.

I'm actually thinking it's possible that if the 3 foot passing rule and Idaho-style stops become law, and we demonstrate that the world isn't going to come to an end for motorists as a result, the climate may be more favorable to get rid of the bike lane mandatory use law in the next 1-2 legislative sessions. These things take time.

I do not believe a mandatory helmet law for adults is on anyone's agenda in this state, whether in the short or long term.

They have, and they've also ticketed cyclists for leaving the bike lane to make a left turn. I'm really not sure anyone knows what Barnum and Balzer are trying to prove. I think some Portland guys on the SS/FG forum have had up close and personal interactions with the Barnum & Balzer Circus, perhaps they could shed some light here.

Why is some guy living on an island complaining about Portland, for crying out loud? Why do the anti-facilities people complain loudest about places they either have never been to or aren't planning to go to any time soon?

Dogma?

Ideology?

Spread the Joy, since his mission is complete at home?

Perhaps because when our local facilities advocates try to encourage our communities to copy those seen in other communities, we want it to be clear which facilities we don't want copied, and why?

We all have local advocates who ask our government for designation of bad designs like door zone bike lanes and two-way sidewalk bike paths through our cities. They use existence of such facilities in other cities as justification for copying them here - if Chicago could get away with marking door zone bike lanes between extra-narrow travel lanes and extra-narrow parking lanes, why not Raleigh?

I think it's important to separate good and bad designs; those that are compatible with best bicycling practices (like riding outside the door zone and riding with traffic rather than on the sidewalk) and those that are not. I'm glad we have to point to other cities to illustrate most of the bad designs, rather than having more of them where we live. Likewise, I wish we had more of the good designs and policies here, like wide, paved rail-trails with minimal junctions; better street connectivity; short-cut paths; sheltered bike parking; traffic signals that detect bicyclists stopped in the travel lane; policies to sweep bike lanes adequately; etc.

i see you still cannot endorse better bike lane designs for your community, even on arterial streets in and out of Cary, steve. you do realize your stunning unendorsement of on-road, bike specific infrastructure is likely helping ****** greater ridership in your community?

Sometimes it looks like you don't read Steve's posts, Bek.

Speaking of Portland bike culture.....is zoobombing VC? :D (I had to bring it up since donnamb brought this event to my attention in Living Car Free)

I guess you (like Chipcom) expect everyone with an opposing view to yours, to post credentials first.

Since I am retired Military, I have lived and ridden in quite a few places. I have ridden in CO, CA, CT, MD, VA, FL, ID, NE, OR, WA, Washington DC, HI, Japan. So not quite the limited experience some want to box me into. It includes Portland and Eugene, OR (the town I bought my bent in) as well.

Your repeated labeling of VC'ers as anti-facilities is really old and has been pointed out to be wrong many, many times. Yet you persist. Makes you appear to have a reading comprehension problem.

Post # 261 - well written Steve and very good points. Sadly, Honolulu has our own extremely bad bike lanes and a bike path we can point too. Some here say "If it is good enough for bike friendly Portland, than it will work fine here."

That is a cool thing, except for the jealous cops.
It would be cool if downtown breakfast joints gave discounts to commuting cyclist year round:D , rather than just one day during bike week.

At least your town and my suburb still have kids that ride to school, and all the kids here do it without riding in a single bike lane.:)

I still want to know where I fit into this "Division" anyway?

I'm an agressive, 365'er, high mileage, vehicular cyclist that supports bike specific infrastructure for the benefits it brings a community, and recognizes a bicyclist can ride vehicularly in a lane classed for bike travel.

where am I sitting in this great, mischaracterized 'division?'

Your the "crack in the wall".;)

That's really sad to hear. Our bike facilities here are carefully planned to fit the place they are meant for. The city is very thoughtful in their planning, and they take into account feedback from people that actually ride the roads they make changes to. I can't imagine living somewhere that they take a idea that was meant for another city and just slap it in place with very little forethought. I'd be deeply frustrated, myself.

Especially considering how hard the folks at the Hawaii Bicycle League (HBL) have worked on some really good cycling projects (not including their support for a mandatory helmet law).

From previous post:
HBL worked extremely hard with the former Honolulu Mayor and the City Council on a street redesign for Young Street. A favorite route of cyclist even though it has many hazards.
“Young Street, Honolulu, HI”
The HBL/City Council plan included a center parking lane (no curb parking), good sight distances from driveways and intersections, wider travel lanes, and yes it included bike lanes. At least the bike lanes were the least dangerous ones, because of the overall design. The City Council and Mayor agreed to fund the plan, yea and a huge victory for HBL.

Then Honolulu had an election, and the new mayor changed the plan. So for all their hard work, HBL only got the new Bike Lane on Young Street between Pensacola Street and Victoria Street pictured below:

Here is the newest Honolulu Bike Lane. It repeatedly weaves left, is in the door zone, has many blind busy driveways and drivers get angry when I refuse to use it.
Honolulu's newest bike lane

Some how, I think we cyclist would have been better off without our brand new bike lane.

I have to admit.....that bike lane SUX!:eek:

Absolutely hideous. I can't even imagine having to deal with a bike lane like that.

That's not a bike lane. :rolleyes: That's just a little extra road paint. Looks like maybe something by Pablo Picasso.