Mos6502

I'd like to see if this can be proven. I mean has anybody actually studied to see if corking actually makes traffic flow smoother? Or is this just speculation?

Philatio

I think it has a lot to do with which CM you're talking about. The one here in Knoxville has had 0 confrontations or negative things happen in the year and a half I've been going. Really peaceful, slow ride through the city. Mostly sober too. Nobody seems to get upset in the cars. I think in this situation it is a good thing. We usually cap out around 50 people in the warm months, when college is in session.

ConstantRider

When CM started in San Francisco in 1992, the SF Bicycle Coalition had a couple hundred members at most. Now it has over 6000. And because it has 6000 members, bicyclists do have some measure of political clout in the city. Over the last ten years especially -- i.e., since the last great Critical Mass controversies of 1997 -- the number of bike lanes in the city has increased dramatically.

Mostly that's due to SF Bicycle Coalition advocacy. While the SFBC is always careful to point out that it doesn't organize CM and has no control over it, there's no doubt that it has grown in part because of CM. (On the other hand, it doesn't owe all of its growth to CM -- I'm a member, and I've never been on a CM ride.)

In the end, I'd say CM, for all its problems, has had a positive impact on cycling in the city. It would certainly be even more positive if its critics couldn't point to incidents like the recent window-smashing. It will be interesting to see what the ramifications of that will be over the next few months.

unkchunk

I've never done a CM ride. The few people I know who have... it's the only time they ride their bikes. The same ol' same ol'.

CastIron

CM isn't about cycling or cyclists. CM is about anarchy. Angry little chillun' getting their cool little piece from whomever happens to be available. That they're on bicycles seems to be mostly incidental. Rubber bullets and tear gas.

dynaryder

Can't this get moved over to A&S? Seriously,I hang out in the Commuting forum because the signal-to-noise ratio is so much better than other forums. Discussing CM has little if anything to do with commuting,but is sure to stir up a flame-fest.

Frankie Fixed

The Crowd in Boston gets too big sometimes. If they were smart they'd split and head in two directions. It'd be fun to meet the other group coming towards you an hour later.

PaulH

I agree.

Paul

randya

You could have the exact same ride with a different name, and no one would care.

randya

Yeah, Banerjak was being kind of sneaky posting this here, he's already worn his welcome out on this subject over in A&S.

Bklyn

I'd be interested to see a breakdown of responses indexed to the respondents' bicycles. This is purely a guess, but I'd bet you'd see a high correlation between "serious" cyclists/roadies and CM hatred.

CastIron

Putting folks in a pigeon hole won't change the facts.

slagjumper

I wonder how much bad will that the semi VC, Lycra clad, Saturday morning, suburban pelaton rides generate. Seems to me more than one shock jock focused his angst at them. My opinion is that, that is some folk’s thing and that is ... OK

Some motorists are put off by children on bikes. And who wants to wear a helmet? What about those high-speed, narrow streets?

What about those damn guys on department store bikes, toting beer and smoking? And immigrants on bikes – cant be good for the rest of us. While were at it even “The Tour” is bad, since it reminds everyone how much drugs play a role in cycling.

Given all of this bad publicity it is a wonder that bikes out sold new cars last year!

CM is no threat to a strong democracy and wont topple the hegemony. The hegomonic order is going to do that all by themselves. When was the last time that an anarchist asked you to pay your tax bill in full while letting the big business man off with half of what is due? Did Sturgis kill the Gull wing honda ralleys -- no. And CM is not going to cause anyone to trade in the CF road bike for a tall bike, a bike with 12 inch wheels or a Schwinn Varsity.

Bklyn

No, but it'll give the "facts" context. My point is that the dischord is largely among the cycling community. I don't think the average driver can differentiate among a roadie, a Critical Mass acolyte, a posenger or a Vehicular Cyclist. We're all off the radar until we're in the way. There is nothing we can do to promote good cycling behavior, which for most people would entail simply vanishing.

banerjek

I thought about this when I posted the poll. I purposely put it in commuting because I think it is the most diverse and level headed forum on BF -- I was hoping to get a read of how utilitarian cyclists see this issue since it comes up constantly. I did not put it in A&S because I didn't see any value in posting a poll that only yahoos would answer.

Granted, the connection with commuting is weak and I have no objections to moving it over. I think enough people have answered at this point to make it clear where most BF members are on this issue.

Nicodemus

CM appeals to those who already agree with cycling, doesn't matter to drivers that are mature enough to respect bicycles as valid forms of transport with rights to the road, and antagonizes dimwits who resent cycles on their territory no matter what.

It's preaching to the choir while simultaneously upsetting the great unwashed who would hate bicycles no matter what you do.

I've only been on one CM ride, that was in Paris. The pace leader was a penny-farthing and someone had an awesomely loud stereo setup on his bike. It was pretty cool, but slow enough to bore a goldfish. Never again.

Overall I think they're ok. As long as they're not invaded by neerdowells. You'll always upset the mouth breathers no matter what you do - there's no point tempering your behaviour just to satisfy their ignorance.

randya

Wrong again, the original concept of Critical Mass was more or less to mimic the motorists' commute, but on bicycles.

jbarros

Incidentally, one of the other gentlemen at my work that commutes in via bicycle was wearing his Iron Maiden Jersey the other day. While we were talking one of the other employees walked by, and said something like (as best as I can remember) the following: "Hey man, you one of those bike riders? I could totally see you out at critical mass breaking in windows and stuff, rock on!" and then walked off.

Now, one can certaintly argue whether or not that reputation is deserved, but it does exist. I don't think it does much for bicycle advocacy, or to help make me less of a target on my commute.

I want to hear more about Critical Manners. =)

-- James

grantpodelco

I just participated in my first Critical Mass ride, in Prague, Czech Republic. I must admit that it left me with definite mixed feelings. In the end, I think such rides may do more harm than good, at least over here. I've written about the experience on my cycling blog at www.praguebikeblog.blogspot.com

Check it out and let me know what you think. I've already gotten quite a few comments.

EnigManiac

We've only just recently discussed this one to death.

https://www.bikeforums.net/advocacy-safety/284556-critical-mass-mob-attacks-van.html

mrpsmr

+1

Michael

donnamb 

Mod Note: I'm merging this with the original thread & moving to A&S. Sorry guys, but let's keep it contained...

deputyjones

I have actually been considering riding in one of these to experience them from the inside out. Of course I would be more of a conscientious objector and would obey the rules of the road, but do you think it would be worth doing it?

pj7

From what I understand, if you follow the rules you'll not be riding in the CM ride, but rather riding a bike while others are rinding in a CM ride.

donnamb 

Depends on where your choices are.