davester

I just took my Nuovo Record RD completely to pieces, including taking out the parallelogram tensioning spring and even after a thorough cleaning I find that the parallelogram is very stiff, taking some effort to move back and forth. I'm wondering if it is supposed to be this way or if there's a problem such as a bent pivot pin. Note that I haven't yet lubricated it following the cleaning steps so I suppose it could loosen up when I put some oil on the pivots, though I'm not hopeful considering how tight it is.

I have another Nuovo Record RD body that I picked up at a flea market for parts some time ago and the parallelogram on that is extremely loose, in fact it has significant play at one of the pivot pins (which is why it is just for parts).

Any thoughts on this? How tight should it be? If I have a bent pivot pin, how would I replace it?

verktyg 

Can't come up an answer to your problem but they should be silky smooth.


The old, thick Campy shifter cables are so stiff that they almost give a puss/pull effect. I used the Campy braided cables instead back in the day.

verktyg

Chas.

Prowler 

Yup. My Pat.76 RD is 'silky smooth'. Chas makes a good point though. May we assume that your RD is stiff while off on the bench? Always separate things when there is a problem. RD first then RD with cable, then RD with cable and shifters.

Otherwise, it sounds like a bent pin. Did you (or can you) roll the pins on a flat glass plate? Did you inspect them for a burr or bump? Any metal out of place on the bodies? Takes very little.

rootboy 

"I just took my Nuovo Record RD completely to pieces..."

I'm not sure but, can we assume from this that you mean you took it all the way down, including removing the pivot pins?
I kinda doubt that so... I'll venture this,

I've only taken a couple of these completely apart, but on one of them, the pivot pins on one side were so worn that there were ridges in the pin where the pin left the front and back plate and entered the upper pivot body. From lots of use. It was very stiff to hand actuate. I had to drill out the pins.

smontanaro 

@rootboy What did you replace the pins with?

rootboy 

Skip, at the time, I had several original Campy pins and bushings. But I found the project so frustrating, I sold them all to a guy on the CR list!
I had better things to do than yank my hair out. The process of rebuilding a NR rear can be done, of course, but I found it very difficult. So gave up.

davester

Sorry, I meant that I took it carefully apart EXCEPT for removing the pins. It's not entirely clear how I would remove the pins since they seem somewhat rounded on the ends. I presume that they get pressed out somehow. Does anyone have any tips on how to do this? Since I have the second scrap derailleur body I can practice on that one and even cannibalize it for pins if need be.

devinfan

Whoever is attempting this, if rootboy gave up - you should too.

rootboy 

Well, I would encourage someone to try it, as I know it used to be done sometimes. But only if they're seriously bored.

I took apart, or tried to take apart, two NR derailleurs, Davester. One came apart like a breeze. On the other, those pins wouldn't budge, no matter what I tried.
I even tried pushing them out using my 5 ton hydraulic press. No go. My experience echoes another member's here, OTIS. These can be a real pain. But I'm sure a mechanic better equipped or skilled than I am might succeed.

I still have one NOS pin, Davester. It measures at 3.48 mm. I never did figure out what material they used for the pins. Some say it was just aluminum bar stock. Maybe so. I tend to suspect it may have been another alloy, like possibly Zamak, (zinc, aluminum, magnesium, copper alloy) or something similar. Something a bit more malleable than aluminum. Don't know. I suspect they peened the ends of those pins using a big pneumatic press. Requiring special jigs and such to hold the part. I don't think that you could use the pins again, once removed from your spare derailleur, as removing them probably requires removing the "peened" end of the pin, on one end, in order to press or pound out the pins.

I've still got a few NOS NR derailleur parts here, including a couple of face plates. But now they just curiosities, for me.
I met my match trying to do this project.

rootboy 

On the tightness, or binding, of your derailleur, I guess you're just actuating the parallelogram in your hands. Difficult but, can you tell which end the stiffness is on? Does the derailleur have a lot of miles on it? If it were me, I think I'd try soaking the whole thing, in solvent first, then drying it, with a little heat if need be. Then soaking it in light oil. Or, squirting something like LPS 1 or similar into the pivots and working it in with much back and forth of the parallelogram by hand.
If there is quite a bit of wear on those pins and bushings, they get just a tad loose, and that would cause binding at a certain point of the travel. In which case, there probably isn't much you can do. But it may still work OK when actuated with a cable and lever.

In my case, I just came to the conclusion that since these derailleurs aren't all that rare, I'd just use another one. But it sure would be nice to revitalize a nice old early 70's version.

rootboy 

Bought all of this over the years, but now gone to a better home. Note the two steel ones on the lower right, used in later derailleurs.

smontanaro 

I loaned a Galli Aero KL derailleur to a CR friend here in Chicago who was going to see how well (if at all) the Galli's removable pins will work on a NR derailleur. They are attached with circlips, so would be a good alternative if they work. (I suspect they probably won't work too well, as the fit in one piece or the other will likely be wrong, but we shall see...)

OldsCOOL

If the actuation is stiff even without the spring tension, you definately have some probs. I had my '86 Trek 760 out for a ride yesterday and was noting (again) how smooth that NR is, this being a Pat84. I hope you find the and can fix the prob.

rootboy 

Good point, Oldscool. Without the spring in, it should have no resistance to move to and fro.

rccardr 

Had a similar NR construction conversation with Wayne Bingham at Velo Classique a few months ago. Had a very nice Pat 78 NR RD that was mechanically great but cosmetically challenged- former owner had rashed the front of the cage plate where it said 'Nuovo Record'. He had access to new cage plates but said that it was so difficult and frustrating to remove and replace the pins (which he did not have in stock) that he would not accept the task from a customer. Which says something.

My guess is that you need to Dremel off one of the pin faces then press it out. I'd then redrill the hole to a standard size and get a machine shop to cut me replacement shafts and use either setscrews or circlips to hold them in place. Might be able to find oversize shafts in a radio control store, used in cars, trucks, helicopters, etc. Mostly they are 3mm, but some might be thicker.

BTW, I simply hand filed and polished the rashed cage plate, looks great. Just need a small Campagnolo decal to put on it...

davester

I think this is the route I'm going to follow. I'm a bit puzzled as to why it is so stiff throughout its travel. Last time I had it completely apart (probably 20 years ago), I vaguely recall that it moved easily. Hopefully I can get the bushing inside to soak up some oil and it will start moving easily again. I doubt that this is wear and binding due to loose pins, although this derailleur has many tens of thousands of miles on it. If anything the pins are too tight.

Drillium Dude 

Me, too - even after I received some beautiful, specialized tools made specifically for hammering the pins back in! Kept the tools and the memories...

OP: drop some lubricating oil on the pivots first, then report back. May be there's just crud in there. I have to do this after dipping those RD bodies in my anodizing-removal solution. There always seems to be some bit of residue that I can never get out of the pivot points.

DD

Drillium Dude 

Ditto

DD

eschlwc

for newbies reading this thread, you should fully overhaul your nr rd, save taking the parallelogram apart and removing its spring.

that's like taking a good brooks saddle off its rails.

Drillium Dude 

Well, you can take the spring out - that is, on the earlier versions - without issue. In fact, it's a good idea so that one can find out if the pivots are moving smoothly.

DD

davester

Hey, it's fixed!! I went at it with a spray can of light Teflon-enhanced oil (forgot the brand name), soaked the pivots multiple times from several angles and then just worked the pivots back and forth, alternating with respraying with oil. It took quite a long time, but eventually some really filthy looking oil dripped out (surprising considering how clean I'd scrubbed the derailleur previously, including 15 minutes in an ultrasonic cleaner) and it started to loosen up. It's definitely not floppy but it moves fairly freely now. Amazingly, after 41 years of very heavy use there's not even a tiny bit of play in the mechanism and it now shines like the sun!

73StellaSX76

It should be smooth, I have no idea why it would be binding, maybe corrosion? I am one of those who has rebuilt with new pins, though I re-engineered it myself. It was some thirty-odd years ago but I likely used brass rod for the pins and had access to a very well stocked machine shop so appropriate press and slip fits were used. This is a PATENT 71 and has a removable parallelogram spring via a removable screw.