Mr Bentwrench

I've got an old Colnago that I bought to ride... but it's just a bit too big for me. Sht! I was going to list it on ebay to get my money back and find that by offering overseas shipping really opens up a much broader market. I know how to box and ship a bike and it seems that the cost would be about $175-$200 to about anyplace in the world. Wife says do it but I have to wonder why that many just flat refuse to.

Question is why don't folks offer overseas sales/shipping? I read that it's a hassel and there is some exposure. True? If so, what am I missing? I know how to pack properly, can read shipping charts and the money clears through Paypal before shipping so where am I exposed on selling my Colnago to a guy in say Toyko or Berlin?

I post this here in C&V because I think its more about the sometimes crazy market for C&V bikes and I would like to hear others opinions and experiences... good and bad.

Wordbiker

Sure, you can ship overseas, but after having a bad experience...you may change your mind.

There's just so much that can go wrong with any shipping, such as boxes run over by forklifts (let's see you pack to prevent that!), holdups in customs, additional surprise charges for both parties, and dissatisfaction by the buyer and the cost of a return that anyone that's ever had to deal with processing a damage claim, persistent demands for shipping status by impatient clients, or lost shipments will tell you it's probably not worth the heartache.

Otis

If you are selling a frame it's not a problem, although you have to watch out for some countries that will only accept a 79" total girth box via USPS (like Australia and parts of Asia). But to countries that accept a 108" box, Priority international is only about $60-$75.

A whole bike on the other hand can be a problem. You need to completely disassemble, removing the fork and right hand crank, then pack in two boxes under the 108" limit. Bike in one, wheels in the other. If the bike is over 57cm it can be a tight squeeze.

If it's a bike worth over $1500 then I don't mind doing all this work, but you need to weigh the hassle. Also you need to consider the market. A run of the mill (not a pre '74) Colnago is going to bring more money in the US, as they are scattered all over the place in Europe. And if it's larger than a 55cm it's not going to get any play in Asia.

Bottom line do your homework on box size limits and what sells.

Cyclist0383

As someone who buys a lot of things from overseas I think the main issue is ignorance on the part of American sellers. They don't seem to have much knowledge about dealing with other countries and are intimidated by the prospect.

Wordbiker

Yes, either that or they know exactly how to deal with other countries and still find it a PITA.

Cyclist0383

What's the difficulty? You put the item in a box and send it. The only difference is you need to fill in a customs declaration form which takes all of about 45 seconds.

I send and receive things from all over the world (just today I received a package from China and two from the States, for example) and have had very few problems, and certainly no more problems with the post than when I lived in the States.

Wordbiker

Then you are most welcome to do so, but someone else choosing otherwise is not by default ignorant or intimidated.

Cyclist0383

If they aren't ignorant of how similar it is to shipping domestic, and they aren't intimidated by the idea of dealing with someone in another country, what would be the reason not to ship international?

I'm honestly curious about your reasoning.

Wordbiker

Simple: Cost

International shipping costs much, much more, so in the instance that one must "eat" the costs of shipping due to any reason, profits dwindle quickly.

International shipping takes time, much more time than domestic shipping, drawing out the transaction completion and also increasing the risk of freight damage. Not everyone is patient, and if there is a readily available domestic market, why wait or take the risk?

I am obviously not alone in these opinions as many vendors state that they do not ship internationally...or are they all ignorant and intimidated too?

Cyclist0383

It what is now a global marketplace I would have to say they are ignorant and intimidated. Just look at all the folks in the US who refuse to ship to Canada when often the Canadian destination is closer to the origin of shipping than a continental US destination.

Also, online merchants in Europe and Asia have much fewer reserves about shipping international which leads me to believe that the issue isn't money but rather attitude.

As for the cost of shipping international it is true that it costs more, but any loses due to having to 'eat the cost of shipping' will be more than made up for by increased sales, and in the case of ebay, higher prices paid by foreign buyers.

Dr.Deltron

If you state that you ship worldwide, then be sure that you add a "boxing" fee, especially for a whole bike.
Then you are getting compensated for your time to box an item for international shipping.
This would really pertain to bikes & frames. I once got a freewheel that was just dropped in an envelope.

I have bought parts from around the world and the biggest hurdle has been the language barrier.
Like the Campy triple crankset from France.
We "communicated" back & forth several times, but I couldn't understand the French, and I dought he could understand my English either.

But eventually, the BEAUTIFUL crankset arrived!

Same goes for the 40 hole Record hi-flange rear hub I was after. Found it in Milan, Italy.

The flip side of all this is that, IMHO, some sellers don't want their item to leave the "neighborhood".

luker

I have had enough trouble with Italian shipments that I just won't do business there any more. I have had enough things disappear in their mail or freight systems that it is more than a crapshoot whether I will ever see the thing or not. I have noticed that several others on eBay are specifically excluding sales and shipping to Italy, the problem is probably systemic over there.

On the other hand, I have bought a few things from eastern Europe and have never had a problem, even though it is very common to see people specifically exclude these countries in their listings.

The dollar is weak, now is the time to sell overseas...

Wordbiker

Sure, if you can get a foreign buyer to pay much more than an item would sell for domestically, that may compensate for the additional inconvenience and risk, but if the end profit is the same...why bother? Do foreign buyers always pay more for an item? What if you only have one unique item to sell and the cost of an issue cannot be absorbed in volume of sales?

My point is, it's a choice made by the individual seller. The way you make it sound, it's a crime to decide against international shipping.

Cyclist0383

Wow, you're really defensive. Did I strike a nerve or something? I've criminalized no one, what I have done is stateed my thoughts on the subject of international shipping from the US and why it isn't, and shouldn't be, a problem.

iab

I have never had an issue with international shippping, either to or from. As mentioned before, the only "risk" over domestic shipping is some countries will charge a lot if the size is "too big". But if a buyer is willing to pay, its not a problem.

The only extra time is literally the less than 2 minutes it takes to fill out a customs slip with your address, the receiver's address and a 3 word description of the contents (vintage bike parts). That's it.

It does take longer to ship, but duh.

I always insist on charging for insurance and with the customs slip, you get "tracking" until it lands in the destination country. That is good enough for PayPal to prove shipment.

Tom Stormcrowe

It can actually be a real problem, Ziemas.....

Try shipping something to the Philippines, for example. $350.00 by US Postal, and $500.00 or more by UPS or Fedex. Customs is a major PITA as well.

Cyclist0383

As a shipper how is customs a pain?

As for cost, of course the buyer of the product pays it; if they don't approve of the shipping costs they simply don't buy the item.

Wordbiker

Well, perhaps it's because you asked me to defend my position and explain why anyone who isn't ignorant or intimidated (inferring that I am if you can disprove my opinions) would have any reason to not ship internationally. I gave you several, as did other posters.

Cyclist0383

One can present an opinion respectfully without resorting to unnecessary hyperbole.

Cyclist0383

It's the 'OMFG! They're all scammers over there!' attitude which keeps people from shipping to Eastern Europe and the Baltics. It's an attitude which is way far off the mark; my PayPal and Visa accounts are no different than any other in Europe.

Mooo

Like "ignorant" maybe?

If it's CONUS to CONUS, you have a pretty good idea of how long it will take - and a reasonable expectation that it won't cost 10x as much to ship to Denver as it does to Pittsburgh. I shipped some prints this winter. To the UK was $5 or $6 - not too bad, but they were folded. Had I had to use a tube, it would have been more like $20 vs $6 domestic. At that point I'm not interested.

And it isn't just the US. I peek at UK Ebay every once in a while, and refrain from patronizing thoughts about listers who won't ship to the US.

I suspect a lot of us are growing sensitive to the patronizing attitude of expats (even those of us who've answered to that category), jokes about geographical ignorance, that sort of thing. Yes, haha, quite funny, the first dozen or so times.

Cyclist0383

Ignorant in the context which I used it simply means not having knowledge about a given situation. It's not difficult to ship overseas. Period.

Why should you as a seller care about the shipping costs if the buyer is paying?

Also, it's not just ex-pats who find this policy annoying.

BTW, who said anything about geographical ignorance? I didn't see any in this thread. Patronizing attitude of expats? Are you carrying something over from other people and other threads?

Mooo

You're right. It is simple to ship overseas.
Ebay's sorting order allows you to specify "price with shipping Highest to lowest." If I say $x for shipping, but it turns out to be 5 or 6 times that for shipping overseas, do I get hammered on feedback? Also, supposing there is a disagreement about item quality, resolution can end up turning the transaction into a major net loss. So I care. I suspect others do too.

The expat thing... I should have phrased it differently. But "ignorant" and "intimidated" are normally pejoratives, and seeing them used with anything like subtlety is quite the novelty.

Ultimately if a seller wants to restrict something to local pickup & cash, I really don't have a problem with that.

Cyclist0383

It's not just ebayers (FWIW my 73 year old father manages to sell a lot on ebay to overseas customers by simply contacting them with the actual shipping cost) but also a lot of online retailers, and it can be very frustrating if there are goods which one needs or wants which are not available locally, or if the local prices are extremely high.

For example I can't get Kool Stop break pads here in Latvia. Urgh.

solveg

EXACTLY! I just did this for the first time. Sending a pair of handlebars to a fellow C&Ver! I wasn't expecting any problems at all... it is* Canada, right?

I will never ship anything to Canada voluntarily again. I'll bet I spent a half hour waiting in line at the PO to spend another 15 minutes filling out stupid forms and getting talked at a lot. I suppose it would have been faster if I did it on a regular basis, but it was a pain! And* it was expensive! There were stupid size rules and wierd customs declarations. But I admit that I wouldn't have been so aggravated had I not had to wait in line so long first. I hate going to the PO period.

I was kinda traumatized, can you tell?