orulz

That's certainly a good summary of her argument, but I'm not about to go along with it. Her feelings aren't necessarily based on sound reasoning. If we just blindly went with emotions on everything rather than stepping back to think rationally then life would be a constant bipolar roller coaster and we'd never get anything done.

Besides, I'm pretty busy these days - so riding to/from work is the only way I can spend a significant amount of time cycling during the week. Rather than having to set aside an extra hour and a half that I don't have at other times during the day, biking to work lets me fit cycling into my schedule and do it without disrupting anything else.

boilermaker1

"...spoken like someone who has already lost his manhood."

I made a living in industrial construction often working hundreds of feet in the air. I ran gangs and jobs with scores of manly men, South Side Irish boilermakers, heeding my commands. When my wife died at the age of 36 I raised 4 kids by myself and paid 2 through college and got the other 2 into the boilermakers. But other than than that I reckon I lost my manhood.

"How you get to work is pretty damned significant."

No, getting to work is significant.

"but she cares about what makes me happy, and that is what matters."

There we go, that's the nut isn't it. What makes YOU happy.

"24 miles a day, 5 days a week vs Toodling around town? that's a huge difference in lifestyle."

Lifestyle?

boilermaker1

Well there you go. You want it your way and that's that. So do what you want to do and let her stew. Be prepared to let her do what she wants to do.

brunop

to the OP--duder you put it out there and i'm gonna tell ya straight. get on your bike RIGHT NOW and never have anything to do with her ever again. she is trying to de-ball you. and she will if you don't get out now. hell, she gave you an out. you are in a world of pain if you let her get her hooks in you like this.

with all due respect, act like ya got a pair.

there's plenty of women (well maybe some) who aren't like this. find one.

orulz

No- that's not what I'm saying.

I'm trying to keep an open line of communication with her on the matter, and to help her realize that cycling is safe, so that she realizes "Oh, maybe it's OK for him to bike to work after all."

And FYI - I'm holding off of cycling to work for now to not push the issue, though I certainly haven't agreed to unconditionally stop cycling altogether.

brunop

dude you're done. we can't help you now.

acroy

If she didn't care for you, she wouldn't care if you rode to work or not.

Since she cares for you, and thinks cycling is dangerous, she's trying to convince you not to.

Be happy she cares!

Since you care about her, and you want to bike, its up to you to a) convince her it's important to you and b) that it's not all that dangerous.

you have statistics on your side, convince her you know what you're doing, deck youself out with lights & have her drive by while you're cycling... show her (in bed) what all that great exercise does for you

my wife is of similar mind but i make a big deal about how i cycle defensively, all lit up, avoid hi-traffic routes, etc and she's okay. I like that she's worried about me

orulz

"Dude," that's not how I operate. I don't want to be with a girl who:
1. won't let me know how she thinks / feels about something, particularly something that upsets her
2. wouldn't get upset if I tell her to, in essence "shut up and deal with it."

Are you speaking from some kind of experience? Are you divorced? You seem to have no idea of how to live a life of give & take, which anyone will tell you is what a lasting relationship is. Do you live your life in constant fear of getting "de-balled?" That's a heck of a way to approach any relationship.

gobot

no, that's when you lost your sense of humor...

ok, mr. serious, I apologize for saying your dong is missing-- But you are speaking from the perspective of someone who lost a young wife-- not from the perspective of someone trapped with a lousy one!

What's a boilermaker anyway?

badhat

...

SonataInFSharp

The fact that there has been an ultimatum given in the first place is a big, bright red flag for all aspects, not just the biking.

gobot

No one else is looking out for you-- if you aren't happy in the long run, its your own fault. It has nothing to do with castration-- but caving in to demands sets a dangerous precedent in the relationship.

badhat

id qualify that its not even about "caving to demands" so much as setting the terms and tone for future discussion.

ultimatums have no place in a loving, mutually supportive relationship.

how on earth do you consider marrying someone who doesnt understand how important bike commuting is to you? and who appoaches discourse with an ultimatum. i cant imagine equivocating on that point.

gobot

rofl

JeffS

You know... There are people out there who can live together and not have to give and take... they can just be.

If you're happy with your particular situation, then who are we to judge. Then again, if you were, I'm not sure you'd be here asking for advice.

For the record though, it's not about getting "de-balled". It's about whether the day comes when you realize your heart is full of regret - and that comes from the things you didn't do.

JeffS

Apparently it's not that important since he gave it up so quickly.

badhat

i have like a 95% confidence that someday, at some point, if you marry this chick, you'll think, and may very well actually say outloud "man, bikeforums was right, what have i done?"

Brian Ratliff

Here's your mistake. Tell her that you'll be okay, that you've done this all before, for several years. That you've developed skills that make it safer for you than your average "joe riding on the sidewalk". Tell her about how you react to traffic, what techniques you use. Make her believe that you know what you are doing and it really isn't as bad as it looks. Show her and make her believe that you have some expertise in the area.

By saying what you did, you reinforced her notion of Russian Roulette; that instead of developing skills to actually lower the risks, you simply accept the risks at face value in a fatalistic sense. This might actually be the thought process you have. But the problem is that, while you have accepted the risks, she has not. In her mind, you have already blown off her concerns, which by her point of view, is an unacceptable start to a lifelong relationship. If she has concerns, you have to accept that she has those concerns and that those concerns are valid and address them directly. Instead, you merely contradict her and dismiss the concerns she is having about you.

You shouldn't stand down and let that conversation be the last words on the subject. Approach her tonight and start out by telling her that you've been doing a lot of thinking about her concern for your safety when riding. Tell her what bicycling means to you and how you've developed as a cyclist. (This kind of assumes that cycling means something for you and that you've been doing it previously.) Describe how it is from your perspective, the traffic game and how you play it to keep yourself safe. Talk with her about her concerns. Feel her out and find out exactly what is bothering her. Don't give her a laundry list of items representing truths as you see them and why her reasoning is bad. Reasure her from both an emotional and logical standpoint. The obvious one, that you'll be killed, is easily countered by citing your experience in not being killed. But then the hard part, talk about why you haven't been killed.

Then, gently but firmly state that you will try it for a few days. Acknowledge that your two lane road is a bit cramped and that you'll try the commute and evaluate it's safety. Who knows, you might find that it is perfectly safe, but the stress of riding on it and maintaining the vigilence and lane position negotiations is extreme and wears you out and makes cycling less fun for you. It would be a shame to fight for your bike commuting rights and then find that you abhor the commute, wouldn't it? Then report back to her with your ride report. Not just the two words: "looks good", but talk about every little detail of your ride. How one part was gravely, how fun the downhill was and how hard the uphill was, how good/bad/indifferent the traffic was and how you dealt with it to make it safe for you. How you met another cyclist and waved. How refreshed (or not) you felt when you made it to work. You get the picture.

brunop

i predict the dude'll cave and marry her. at least we tried.

sell your bike now i guess. get a minivan, drive to your cubicle, and live in the 'burbs. i hope it works out.

Gurgus

That is a safe bet. This guy wont listen to the advice any more than any other guy in love did before he got married. I certainly didn't and neither did your dad, which is a good thing for the human race, no?

Marriage isn't for everyone, its a game of give and take. My wife didn't like the idea of me riding at night, but she knows me well enough to know that if I want to do something badly enough, I'm not going to let her stop me. Same goes for her as well. She also knows that I'm careful and I've had no major issues yet.

Point is, life is too short to not live the way you want to live. Its also waaaay too long to live the way someone else wants you to because of their unfounded "fears".

badhat

i mean in his defense, try telling your family you broke up with your fiance cuz the internet told you to

Gurgus

oh man, that would be fantastic. Imagine the looks on their faces?

rlrct

When I decided that I wanted to start commuting into work by bike, my wife of 25 years wasn't happy either. I mentioned the idea to her, we discussed it and she thought it was just an idea until mail order stuff like a high-viz jersey and headlights started showing up.

She's concerned about my safety, so we talked about a few things like:

• Riding early in the morning is probably safer, even in the dark, than during the day because there is a LOT less traffic.
• My recreational rides take me on roads that are just as busy as the ones I commute on, and she doesn't really fret too much about those rides (other than wanting to generally know where I'm going).
• I've taken a lot of steps to make myself as visible as possible like the high-viz jersey and a new rear blinkie that's driven from the headlight battery rather than penlight cells.
• I promised I wouldn't ride in the rain. The day will come when I get wet, but if it's forecast to rain when I'll be riding - I drive. We've had a couple times when it rained during the day but the forecast was for rain in the morning and clear later, so that worked out OK. I do check the radar loop on the computer to see if it's going to rain 5 minutes after I leave the house. I frankly don't want to ride in the rain because the cager idiots around here have enough trouble avoiding other cars in the rain, let alone a bicycle that they aren't paying attention to. It'll be realy interestin when I tell her that I'm thinking about turning my old mountain bike into a winter commuter.
• One concession I made was that I call from my cell phone and ring the phone when I get to work so she knows I've arrived safely. My initial reaction was that's a pain in the butt and I shouldn't need to bother doing that - but it's actually not a big deal. I have a few minute walk from where I park the bike to our fitness center and the showers, so I just do the phone thing on that walk. It's a little thing to me that means a lot to her.

The basic point I'm trying to make is that you can do things to mitigate your fiancee's anxiety. For those who will say that I've been castrated because I do the "ring the phone" bit, I'd say that it takes bigger kahunas to do that than it does to argue about it. She's a bit of a worrier and that's just one of a few things I've done to reduce her anxiety.

Bottom line - ask her what you can do to appease her worries and agree to the things that aren't time-consuming or a hassle to do.

badhat

did this thread just lose several posts

badhat

oh gimme a break