IcySmooth52

I've gotta say, I think the whole Surly line is a rip-off. There's far better bikes for the price, they're tanks, have a dead ride (even though they're steel), and are even ugly! I've also noticed they tend to have rust.

It's just, why?



*I ask here because the Cross Check seems to be the most common.

Wilfred Laurier

Surly has done a very good job of marketing their mediocre 1970s technology bikes as something special.

In reality, though, their bikes are good enough that if you are riding one and cannot keep up with your riding partners, it's not the bike's fault.

justin1138

Mostly they're inexpensive and brand recognition. They also have a good, positive attitude (more than most if you ask me) about bikes and life in general. I'd also imagine a bit of luck on Surly's part.

cale

Lots of folks pick iPhone's too.

fietsbob

"What you see, depends on where you look"..

Business-wise, many bike shops have a main bike brand lines and a QBP account too ,

QBP has contract companies like Maxway Taiwan make decent reliable steel tig welded frames to their specs..

.. then they ship to dealers when ordered.


Hand made premium steel frames is in a price point Most people are unwilling to spend.. they cost even more ..




Reply below suggests the poster is really cheap. How about find a Job that pays More?

prices will not fall, much if at all in any future that can be foreseen .. inflation is a fact of life in the economy.

Unless stolen property, better for less is just not going to happen.

IcySmooth52

I know they're a house brand of QBP, which I've yet to know a bike shop that doesn't have an account with them. But they're a rip-off still, not being cheap for a simple steel frame.

I think this is a good explanation though. They're just "cool". The hipster effect?

FrozenK

Good marketing, affordable prices, and most important: willingness to produce frame for niche markets. There may be a lot of options now, but ten years ago the CrossCheck was one the few. It is also a versatile frame, which would be another plus for Surly frames in general.

cale

Steel, as a frame material, matches up nicely with many current themes in fashion. Nostalgia (carefree), style (you can't be too thin!), economy, comfort (not too twitchy or harsh riding) and authentic (steel's real) are all all qualities that a great many young bike buyers are looking for in a bike. The Surly brand is ideally suited to deliver the goods and young buyers typically spend more of their disposable income on bikes.

flargle

First, Surly bikes are not rip-offs by any stretch of the imagination. They are spec'd very intelligently and are high-quality bikes. They work through bike shops so, yes, there are other outfits out there who can sell similar bikes for less money.

The main reason you see so many people riding them is because they have lasting credibility among bike people. Compared with other brands, they have been years ahead of the curve on several big trends, because the place is run by rank-and-file bike dorks who sell what they like. These trends include:
(1) singlespeed (1x1)
(2) 29ers (Karate Monkey)
(3) fixed gear (Steamroller)
(4) fat bikes (Pugsly)
(5) cyclocross (Cross Check)
(6) trailer bike (Big Dummy)

So you have reasonably priced, reliable bikes that have a distinctive and original aesthetic, and to top it off, loads of people who work at bike shops ride them and love them.

Mr IGH

OP is just stirring crap, nothing he claims is remotely true....

Surly isn't a rip-off, it's a perfectly fine bike frame for the money. LOL on the 70's geometry, when did that go out of style? Surly makes good frames that works well for what they're designed to do, at a reasonable price that allows the LBS to make a few bucks. It's heavy so it won't break, every low cost Asian frame is that way.

CBBaron

CrossCheck is popular because it is versatile. Sure there are other bikes a little cheaper with the same components. But few can also run 45mm tires, fit fenders and rear rack, be run SS or geared and are ready for down tube shifters. I got a CrossCheck because I wanted a SS road bike with 42mm Marathons, full fenders and a rack that would take urban commuting abuse in all weather. It has done an excellent job in that capacity and now that my needs have changed I have put on some lighter tires and removed the fenders and rack and it is doing a admirable job as a SS gravel grinder.

Many of Surly's other models have similar flexibility that is or was unique in a readily available model.

Craig

snow_echo_NY

this. it does everything. it's my commuter. i'm faster on my crosscheck than i was ever on my road bike. it's an awesome ride. i personally love riding it just as much as i enjoyed my road bike. it's so easy to personalize to what you want. i see so many different crosschecks configured differently depending on the person and the ride they want to do. everyone i know who has one loves their ride. many converts coming from road bikes to cross checks here in NYC (i've talked to at least 4, so perhaps i'm mistaken given how big NYC is maybe there are others that sell their CCs for a roadie? i don't know).

eastbay71

I think these two previous posts really point to their marketing as the reason why. I wouldn't disagree with either of the posts BUT my 72 Nishiki that i paid $40.00 is just as versatile has braze ons for racks fenders and water bottles takes large tires can mount DT shifters etc. There are mountains of old steel frames out there that are just as good and versatile as a Surly but they have no one marketing them.

snow_echo_NY

i can't disagree with that. for those of us that don't know what to look for or how to build up a steel bike, it's kinda perfect. the LBS i bought it from will also do some tunes for us. it makes sense to get something economical but we're talking about time, effort, choosing and buying parts, finding your particular size etc. the people who run surly thought about that stuff, pre-packaged it - totally worth it for me to not have to think about that stuff.

and as i ride it - i have time to try it out and think of things i might want to change on the bike (etc), b/c the LBS i bought from is willing to work with me on that.

eastbay71

I honestly think Surly are decent bikes too. I haven't owned a Surly but I've had two All Citys (Macho Man and Mr Pink) which have about the same design and sales philosophy. I see how they appeal to someone that is an individualist and wants to have a versatile bike but is not a bike mechanic.
That being said I will share a story. I've been wanting to get a cargo bike so I can bike to the grocery store and laundrymat. While waiting at a traffic signal two gentleman rode past carrying large black garbage bags on walmart bikes. That reminded me that all bikes are cargo bikes and we shouldn't be so rigid in our definitions of what they do. hell when I was a kid i would ride my 20" BMX at least 100 miles a week. I would never do that today.

eastbay71

i hadn't taken into account the guerrilla marketing on the forums lol!

Andy_K 

I've had two Surlys -- a Cross Check and a Long Haul Trucker.

I bought the Cross Check mostly because of favorable opinions from Cross Check owners. I was replacing a 1977 Gitane Gypsy Sport that I bought for $40 and rebuilt as a single speed. The Gypsy Sport had hi-tensile tubing and originally came with 120mm rear spacing, but I cold set it to 130 so I could use a modern road wheel with a single cog and spacers. The quill stem was stuck when I bought it but it eventually worked itself loose. The seat tube was an odd size. The frame didn't have a hanger for a rear derailleur. The bottom bracket was standard threaded, but it took an enormous effort to get the old cups loose. In short, while I was able to get the old Gitane frame to do what I wanted as a single speed bike, it wasn't as smooth as it would have been if I had started with the Cross Check, and it wouldn't have been quite able to make the transition to using gears, which I later made with the Cross Check. The Cross Check also had more tire clearance.

In the end I sold the Cross Check because I was never able to get it to fit quite to my satisfaction. The ride honestly wasn't any better than that of the Gypsy Sport, but it was a good utility bike and I was able to have a lot of fun with it.

I bought the Long Haul Trucker as a used frameset. It was a replacement for a 1989 RockHopper that I had put together as a beater bike. To be honest, I bought the LHT because I liked the color, though again the popularity of Truckers among internet users elevated it in my mind. This is the only true touring bike I've ever owned. I built it up in the spirit of touring bikes (relaxed riding position, low gearing, etc.). I have never really loved my LHT the way I do some of my other bikes, but I've always been aware that this is precisely because it's a touring bike. I don't often find myself looking for a slow, comfortable ride. I don't tour much. Earlier this month I finally used it for touring (a week long trip on the Great Allegheny Passage and C&O Canal Towpath). It did great. I still can't say I love it, but it was definitely the best of my bikes for the job. It's a mule. If you like race horses, you may not love your mule, but there are times when you need a mule.

I'm not aware of any bikes, new or used, that can be had significantly cheaper than a Long Haul Trucker that do what it does any better.


In summary, if you know what you're getting with a Surly frame -- a basic, dependable steel frame and fork, optionally built with a reasonable selection of components -- they are decent bikes for the price. Their value is a bit inflated by marketing-based reputation, but that also reflects in their resale value, so it's not entirely a bad thing.

intransit1217

I would have guessed you were in Surly's HQ state. Wisconsin has a "Trek problem". Ha!

Mr IGH

At the beginning of last year's gravel grinding season I was riding a 73 Super Course frame and lost my nerve. Riding in a pack at 25mph, blasting through pot holes and rumples on a 40 year old frame with un-known history is crazy. On my second pack ride all I could think about was how drunk the British brazer was when he made my fork 40 years ago. I dumped that old piece of junk and upgraded to a Soma Saga for less than $500, brand new, nice and heavy (1 1/8" fork is much stronger than 1"), takes 42mm tyres, tons-o-braze-ons and disc brakes too.

And 72 Nishikis didn't have bottle bosses or seat stay rack bosses from the factory, you've got the wrong date or they were added sometime later.

eastbay71

The rear rack can be attached to the seat clamp bolt no problem. Many racks from this era just clamped to the seat stays. I did add the water bottle bosses which is quite easy to do.

eastbay71

Of course to each there own, everyone should ride what they're comfortable with but statements like this always make me ask myself a couple questions. First, what do you expect to happen if there is a failure. Do you expect the bike to break in half? More likely it would crack and you wouldn't notice until you cleaned it. Second if a bike made it 40 years what makes you think its just waiting to fall apart? I would more likely take the its made it this long side of the discussion. And finally how many folks have actually ever experienced a cracked frame? I rode poor quality BMX and mountain bikes in my teens through heavy crashes and large jumps without an issue. I hit a moving car once on a Schwinn Sting Ray it bent the fork but the frame was intact.

dgodave

I ride a Krampus. When it came out, there was nothing like it. And I still think its amazing.

Mr IGH

That old rattle trap is a time bomb. If you're riding on smooth streets, maybe it's ok. If you're riding with some aggressive riders on rough gravel roads I would replace the fork at minimum. Or make sure your dental insurance is paid up....

eastbay71

So whats that in your signature about old frames then...Just Bulls#!t?

Mr IGH

This is the gravel grinder forum, I do ride with a club that is know for being fast and aggressive. My point; I find it an inappropriate use of vintage frames with unknown history to be used for a bike that is ridden off paved roads as a gravel grinder. Esp when there are so many low-cost options for a modern frame, brand-new, built in factories that have actual measured quality.

And wrt OP saying Surly sucks "it's just marketing" and you chiming it, I don't agree. Surly is a nice, low cost option that a rider can get in a few days and ride with confidence. I find the idea that a $40 frame from 1972 with unknown history is a good value compared to the retail price of a Surly ($470 for a Disc Trucker) to be a false economy.

Here's my Soma Saga Disc gravel grinder/commuter/tourer (same factory/geometry as the Surly LHT with sloping top-tube). I hammer away on club rides and never worry about component/frame failure, no matter if on gravel or even trails:

https://www.bikeforums.net/commuting/...l#post17614374



I do ride vintage steel, here's a thread about my road bike, it's a 78 Austro-Damlier full 531 that I upgraded with braze-ons and modern components. I know every day of its history, I pulled it out of the box and assembled it back in 1978. I ride it on paved roads with my club, not gravel/trails and its never been crashed:

https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vi...-you-call.html



Here's my 1972 Super Sport IGH commuter, I don't know its history and I am planning on replacing the fork. To its credit, the steerer is a Schwinn 13/16" and is tapered at the crown so it's much beefier than a standard Euro style 7/8" steerer and the joints are exposed so any cracking will be more easily noticed:
https://www.bikeforums.net/commuting/...l#post16638686
https://www.bikeforums.net/commuting/...l#post16639120