datlas 

How very 41 of him.

I wonder if there should be a way that "archived" threads with no activity for say 1 year should be locked?

coasting 

why is a longer stem supposed to be squirely? I would expect it to be less responsive because you have to move in a bigger circle. I rode a ladies bike with a teenie short stem and it was really really twitchy.

timtak

I have found a cheaper source for long stems: trial bike stems. They tend to be 120-170 with a 30 degree 'rise' but I am pretty sure that they can be put upside down. Since my forks are raked back at 72 degrees, a 30 drop will only result in a 2 degree downward angle. I have ordered a 150mm +/- 30. Climbing bicycle NEON 30 degrees 130mm 3D forging Stems Trial Bike accessories-inBicycle Stem from Sports & Entertainment on Aliexpress.com

Young Version

Check your math again.

Homebrew01

stem length. what's too long?
BF Thread: What's too old ? (Who says search doesn't work )
Shoes: What's too big ?
Jersey: what's too large ?
Sandwich: What's too much ?
Chocolate: What's too much ?

redlude97

lol

rms13

I've had 90-100 on most bikes. I have 120 on my current and it feels perfect

timtak

Oops. Minus 12 degrees! Thank you. Well it will be fun trying it out. I will report back.

Clipped_in

Another 41 thread that really delivers!

Homebrew01

It has been proposed before. And they could be unlocked in the .01 % of the time when it makes sense.

timtak

I am sorry to have disturbed FIVE ONE SIX with a notification email on a very old thread that may no longer be of interest to him (or her). I am not sure why datlas or Homebrew01 should mind the thread being reopened. I like to think that posting to old good threads aggregates information and increases knowledge.

Such as a long time ago, That is a very good point. All time trial bikes have, effectively, very long stems. I never ride in a peloton, so I am hoping I will be okay with my 150mm -30, except perhaps I will need an angled top cap, or cheaper, I can cut a headset spacer like this, but in the reverse direction:


Some folks have even more "aggressive" downward angles (-45 degrees effective, so the stem -65 degrees?) at about the 5:10 mark in this video
This is taking the thread away from stem length, but stem angle and length are related. Received wisdom (here too) is that long stems are generally relaxed stems because headsets slope backwards, resulting in a higher handlebars, and upright riding position with longer stems. One has to find a -18 degree stem (in my case) just to get the stem horizontal! These are rarely even available in road bike stems these days with the -17% 3T ART being the most aggressive available at my LBSs.

Cobb Cycling's wind tunnel backed advice -- get down low - seems so good, yet there are so few bike geometries, or stems to facilitate it these days.

redlude97

Zipp Service Course SL also comes in 17, they are very nice IME

Doc V

I believe that stems are measured from the center point of the fork tube to the center point of the handlebar clamp.

Team Sarcasm

I am on a 56cm caad10 w/a 110m stem. love it!

coasting 

short and thick,
does the trick.

ColnagoC40

What's a stem???








Just jokin.

I have always sized my frames to work with a 100mm stem, 5' 11" 30" inseam, always look for a top tube of around 55cm.

gsa103

Only racers typically have the flexibility required to achieve an extreme low position. The vast majority of cycling enthuasists don't have the lower back & hamstring flexibility required to get into an optimal aero position. The popularity of endurance frames with longer head tubes really points to this. Much of the pro peloton rides frames that are a size or two smaller than traditionally recommended with a very long stem. The smaller frame reduces the stack height, allowing them to get into a lower position with a long -17 stem.

Just remember, getting a 5% more aero doesn't help if you produce 10% less power because of an uncomfortable position.

Bandera

Sheer utter nonsense.

Selecting the proper stem length for a particular rider is not done in isolation. It comes well into the fit process after selecting the proper frame size, crank arm length, setting saddle height and on and on for an individual rider.

Bottom line, get a proper fit from someone who knows what they are about w/ what kit fits/works for you. The "right" stem length is produced in many increments to fit different folk w/ individual requirements.

-Bandera

timtak

I am no racer, and I have low flexibility, but I am finding that I could and would go down lower for longer but it is difficult to get the bike/parts -- stem -- to put the bars in the place required (I know I could get a tri bike or aerobars but I want my hands on the breaks and the flexibility of standard drop bars).

Is there a minus 65 degree stem (such as Mr. Cobb seems to be setting in the above video) in any stem size?

I can't even slam that stem because I have a traffic cone in the way.

Specialized FELT etc tell us that bikes are made for TDF racers but, as you point out, this is a lot of tosh. I think that bikes are made for people with bellies because they may be the biggest market.

gsa103

It looks like Cobb is using an adjustable stem slammed to full negative.
Pro Adjustable Stem - Road Stems

Or there's a 30deg stem:
Ritchey Pro 30 Degree Stem - Road Stems

I believe someone was selling replacement headset caps to eliminate the traffic cone effect.
Headset Bearing Cover ? Black | Metallic Poutine

timtak

Thank you.

It looks like the Adjustables and Ritchey's are a bit short at 120mm.
That is my fault for getting the wrong sized frame. But then, bearing in mind the design of head tubes, perhaps I was lucky to get a short frame, so that I can slam it with a -30, without using an adjustable -65 degree or so stem.

I will look into those metal bearing covers. Thanks aqain.

Tim

Jiggle

Stack of steerer spacers, then a downward sloping stem, then some upward pointing hoods. Funny looking.

timtak

It seems that he has some of the steerer spacers above the stem. Perhaps he has a "traffic cone" problem too. But, yes, there does seem to be at least one spacer below the stem so he could have slammed a bit more before using his -65 degree (or thereabouts) stem.

But as for the upwards pointing hoods, I want my hoods to be upwards pointing so that I can rest a bit of weight on on them.

I look foward to my 150mm -30 and will post a photo in about three weeks or so.

surgeonstone

12 inches, under that is good.

timtak

My trial bike 150mm 'riser' stem arrived from China (50USD). It has an angled 'top' and came with an angled headset cap but when reversed, for a 30 degree drop (not rise), it results in the need for a wedge shaped spacer. But in terms of length and drop it feels okay. My previous stem was 135mm and I could see my front axle a little. Now, when I am on the hoods at least, the bars are obscuring my axles. This lore (have your stem, such that the handlebars obscure your line of sight to your front wheel axle) seems to me to be a good idea.

And to be honest I like being on the hoods, horizontal hoods. I use my drops fairly rarely.

I think that most cyclist spend most of their time on the hoods of their road bikes. There are probably good reasons why TT bikes have strange four pronged E shape bars with the shifters on different prongs to the brakes (what is it with that?) but I like to have my hands on my brakes and shifters in the same place.

So, the result is a pretty TT position on some conventional drop handlebars. And if I use the drops I will be (Cobb-saddle-video-like, see above) road-parallel.
My beer belly is protruding a bit so it will be a little while before I do that though. June is the rainy season here in Japan and so cycling is fraught.


150mm -30 degrees Stem by Timothy Takemoto, on Flickr">

Drop by Timothy Takemoto, on Flickr">

By the way, with regard to stem length, and saddle position, and were one should be fore-aft on the bike, this video was very interesting
It is almost as if everyone is in two minds about where we should be.

Or perhaps KOPS is a UCI enforced myth? TOPS (thighs over pedals) or HOPS (hips over pedals) may be where we really want to be?
Note that my seat post stem is offset forwards (I twisted it 180 degrees) and my saddle is at the far forward position on the saddle rails. I like it that way.