alanbikehouston

You are joking? All of Trek's OCLV models, every single one, is made in Wisconsin. Of the dozens of models of bikes sold by Cannondale, all but one or two are made in Pennsylvania (and Cannondale is building a carbon frame facility, and soon will be making 100% of its bikes in the USA).

Looking at the Tour de France between 1997 and 2007, tell us precisely WHICH year the winner was riding a "rebadged Giant".

Giant makes some nice bikes, including some of the best in the world. But, in the $2,000 to $8,000 price bracket of the best road bikes, Giant has only a tiny share of the world-wide market.

Schwinn? Yes, Schwinn still makes first-class bikes. They are sold by Richard Schwinn under the "Waterford" name, as the "Schwinn" name is currently owned by a toy company.

akatsuki

I was talking to my roommate the other day and we talked about how we had Schwinns when we were younger, then moved onto Peugeots, and then gave up biking for a while.

The high-end road market is so endorsement heavy that to enter into it requires a huge influx of cash and R&D generally. The low-end crap market is a whole different game of cost margins and volume.

While you can compete in both, the advantages are mainly in the deals you can get buying huge volumes of other parts (like Shimano gruppos...).

I think the Peloton is a pretty nice bike, but I am not sure that I would buy it over a Pedalforce or some other generic CF frame, since that appears to be what it is.

Then again, I think the touring craze of the 80s will probably return as those bikes generally make more sense of people than race bikes.

whitemax

Peloton, that's too funny. Maybe they should call it Phantom, as in a bike that ain't in the peloton.

big john

Like Yao Ming, I have a Gunnar, named after Richard Schwinn's dog.

Ozrider

Paramount is still around, it just has a different name: Waterford. Waterford Cycles are owned by Richard Schwinn, the only member of the family still making bikes.

They are made in Waterford, Wisconsin, just south of Milwaukee. They are great bikes, comparable to a Mercxx or Orbea.

I don't know the whole story, but when the Schwinn family lost the company, Richard Schwinn somehow ended up with Paramount. It is probably an urban legend, but the story in Wisconsin goes that when the company was sold, Richard Schwinn walked out of the Chicago HQ with all of the designs and plans for high end bikes. I believe he is the son of the last CEO.

For some reason, Schwinn was required to change the name from Paramount to Wateford. I think Pacific bought the name or something from the previous owners.

Nonetheless, there is still a Schwinn making tremendous bikes. Check out their website. I recommend these bikes highly.

AdamJaz

My mom's boyfriend rides a fastback or something, a Schwinn with Dura Ace, full carbon, selle san marco saddle, all stock. Ksyrium wheelset. he likes it.

ThinLine

All that says alot about our complacent, ignorant, breadbox mentality society if you ask me. Duhh...I don't know....I just want a cheap, junky, heavy, non-functionin, bike for myself and my kid.
And since the apple does not fall far from the tree....Duh... my kid will raise its kid to do the same.
America.....If you don't expect quality...you came to the right place.

BarracksSi

Speaking as someone growing up when Huffy and Schwinn was in almost every garage and backyard...

You see, nobody knew about the fancy bikes. Because of that, nobody cared about the fancy bikes.

$100, to a kid in the 1970's, is a lot of money. You'd have to mow a lot of lawns or deliver a lot of newspapers to collect that kind of scratch. If you can buy a bike -- if you can buy freedom to roam beyond your immediate neighborhood -- you don't care if it can be lighter. You want a bike that looks cool and feels fun to ride. You're gonna get that bike.

VT Biker

Wow....so because a bunch of people have at most a passing interest in cycling, they should plop down tons of their hard earned cash to purchase something they will likely use sparingly?

Do you realize there is something called resource contraint, and each of us has limited resources and time to focus and spend on specific hobbies and items. That same so called low-lying fruit you just picked on for buying a cheap bike may very well have spent mucho bucks on a sail boat, or cross-country ski equipment, or down-hill ski equipment or who knows what else. Just because you are more interested in a hobby to the point that you are willing and committed to learning more than the basics does not mean that someone else passing interest in that hobby makes them low lying fruit.

JayC

Performance has them.

bigbossman 

On the nose, my friend. When I was growing up, EVERYONE had a Schwinn Varsity. And those that didn't wished they did. The lucky kids had Continentals. They were solid and unbreakable, they were cool, and they gave us the freedom to roam far and wide. AND, we could afford them if we really, really saved our beans from the paper route income.

We rode them everywhere, and did everything with them. Wheelies, curb-jumping, some dirt track, riding doubled up with someone on the Plescher rack in back. We used them for "work" on our paper routes, rode them to school, rode them to each other's houses, and rode the hell out of them on the weekends.

We used them heavily, and abused them badly. They never broke, and they seldom needed anything more than new tires and bar tape once in a while.

Those are days gone by. No such bike exists anymore, but in it's day a Schwinn Varsity was the biggest bang for the buck around.

cs1

Schwinn and Mueller own Waterford but not the Paramount name. It's is a great bike, I own 2 of them.

Tim

VeloLisa

Ah, memories. Good times, good times...

BarracksSi

You got me to google for the Varsity, and I found this page:

https://www.franksbikes.com/rent.htm

Check out the Fastback near the bottom of the left column. Metallic orange, sparkly banana seat, apehanger bars, and -- the killer feature -- a "floor-mounted" shift lever.

Scoff if you want, but man, that sucker's cool.

Then there's the Hurricane, which has a big knobby rear tire and a seat that looks like it was lifted from a Honda motorbike of the same era.

I'm kinda torn between the Apple Krate and the Orange Krate myself.

VeloLisa

Wow! There's my my Stingray!

https://www.franksbikes.com/51.JPG

Hambone

I had one of them in green with a sissy bar.

ThinLine

You are correct and I did not mean to sterotype. I have seen first hand many people go for the dime store bike when getting into cycling and end up saying; nah...bikes a piece of junk. If I were starting out in a new hobby or sport, I would buy something middle of the road. i.e. bowling ball, tennis racket, foosball table, etc. with a inkling towards the purpose of the sport at hand. It helps.

oilman_15106

Are you saying my 1989 Prelude was made by Giant in Taiwan? Just curious.

One big problem Schwinn and many other brands that offer some good bikes is distribution or lack of dealers.

BarracksSi

Optimistically, I'd hope that they'd begin to enjoy biking for the sake of biking and not get so focused on the gear they've got. Maybe they'll take a good look around and find out about the better-quality bikes and upgrade, or maybe they'll just work harder to keep their current bikes operating and not throw them away.

When it comes down to it, it's all about enjoying the ride. Doesn't matter to me how people find it.

Scooper

Your 1989 Prelude was made at the Schwinn manufacturing facility in Greenville, MS., managed at that time by Richard Schwinn, now co-owner (with Marc Muller) of Waterford Precision Cycles. I think merlinextraligh was referring to the early nineties "PDG Series" Paramounts, which were imported by Schwinn in an attempt to leverage the Paramount name by offering a lower cost option to the Waterford built Paramounts which were marketed at the same time with a considerably higher price tag.

NormanF

Schwinn? My first bike was a Schwinn... that was stolen. My second was a Schwinn, that was totaled in an accident. My third Schwinn is my Schwinn Black Phantom... I still have it. Now I'm lusting after ONE more Chicago Schwinn to add to my bike collection.

NormanF

Schwinn was viewed as a marque for the average cyclist. The Chicago Schwinns are classics. I don't think any bikes made today come close to them in the unique method of fabrication and manufacturing with which they were made. They represent the end of an era in American manufacturing and while the Chicago factory is long gone, the bikes it made in the millions are still on the road today.

On Your Right

[QUOTE=AchiLLe..s;4971658][QUOTE=Pwnt;4961547]
So my question is...why aren't more people riding Schwinn?:

QUOTE]

I Do!!!

HAMMER MAN

https://www.waterfordbikes.com



click on the site and go to resources and read about both legends, Schwin/Waterford
brief synopsis listed below.


I own a 1999 2200 lugged 853 road bike, in all the years I have been riding {30 yrs now} and all of the different bikes I have owned and still own this bike by far is one of the greatest not because of legend but because of craftsman ship



Waterford History

Waterford's Roots

A century ago when the bicycle's popularity peaked for the first time, a young German engineer named Ignaz Schwinn started a bicycle company in Chicago, then, the world center of bicycle building. Fifty years later, his son, who had started mass producing bikes, created a special place within this factory to build elite racing machines. By pioneering the use of high-strength steel alloys and then later, low-temperature silver brazing, this factory dominated the US racing scene for decades. Many noted framebuilders such as Albert Eisentraut served their apprenticeship under the master framebuilders.

In the late 1970's, a young rider, designer and builder named Marc Muller brought the experience and innovation from his own framebuilding enterprise and took charge of building these elite bicycles. Marc moved the factory to Waterford, Wisconsin and continued building elite bicycles and also created a cycling design laboratory.

Marc and his staff introduced a number of key innovations including oversized tubing, 26" wheels, cast-in cable guides and our patented full suspension system. These advances allowed them to design and build bikes for National and World champions such as Ned Overand, Marc Allen, Mike Engleman, Tom Prehn and many others.

Marc Muller and Richard Schwinn, manufacturer and great-grandson of Ignaz formed an independent organization, completely dedicated to building fine bicycles. Less than two years into the new business, Waterford and Criterium rider Jeanette Norris earned its first national championship. In less than five years, Richard Widmark earned Waterford's first world Championship and we now have dozens of national championships under our belt including the 1999 USAT Professional Women's Triathlon Championship.

In a world where America again leads in elite bicycle design, our team of designers, riders and builders continues a one hundred year commitment toward excellence and innovation.

Design Philosophy:

The renaissance in American framebuilding and design has grown from the many experiments of builders and inventors who continue to explore new materials, structures, geometries and applications for the bicycle. While we also experiment and watch with excitement the developments in our field, we don't believe in using our riders as test pilots.

We believe that good fit and geometry have more impact on rider performance than any other factor. Our selection of materials, design of tubing and lugs as well as integration of other components assures high performance at every level.

We design and build our bikes so that twenty years from now you will feel as good about your investment as you did the day you made it. While many companies have moved toward disposability, we continue to offer bikes that are completely repairable. We believe this gives you more choices as a rider: the choice to adapt your bike to future innovations or to restore your bike to like-new condition. This also places less stress on our world's precious resources.

Every aspect of every Waterford has been carefully considered and reconsidered by designers and engineers who love to ride, and who seek for themselves, and for you, the ultimate bicycle frame.






Paramount History
Early Years
1960's-70's
PDG - 80's-90's
PDG "Series"
Dating My Bike
Statistics

Paramount History
Early Years
1960's-70's
PDG - 80's-90's
PDG "Series"
Dating My Bike
Statistics



Paramount History
The Schwinn Paramount represents the cultural roots of Waterford. For decades America's leading competition and custom bike, the Paramount represented the ultimate aspiration of every young American racer and bike builder.

From its introduction in 1938 to the final bikes of the 1990's, the Paramount advanced both the art and science of bicycle design and craftsmanship, as Waterford has continued in its own history. For this reason it holds a special place in our hearts.

We've divided the Paramount history into three phases. First the early years from 1938 through 1958. Paramount burst on the scene in the late 30's and enjoyed phenomenal sales, only to be nearly snuffed out by World War II. After the war, interest in racing and fine bicycles waned until the late 50's.

Second came the so-called Golden Years from 1959 to 1979. This is the period when Paramount dominated the US pro bike scene and inspired many a racer and builder.

Finally came the Waterford Paramount era, led by Marc Muller. This became the basis Waterford Precision Cycles.

Scooper

That's the bottom line, and it's American craftsmanship.

I have a 1972 Schwinn Paramount touring bike made of 531, chrome plated, and equipped with Campy Nuovo and Record components. It's an incredibly comfortable and compliant ride. In May, I took delivery of a new Waterford custom 953 frame based on the 2200, and equipped with Campy Record. The Waterford has the same legendary ride as the old Paramount, but is six pounds lighter. The Waterford's heritage is apparent in this photograph.