ds650

When I bought my 2012 Scott CR1 team in June I bought it at a shop two hours away because I liked the 2012 colors better and as a left over 2012 model I saved like $700. So fast forward to last Friday, for its first tune up I just decided to just take it to the local Felt shop I bought my sons bike at.

I told them to check out the head tube closely as since week one on occasion it made a funny hollow sound when I hit a bump a certain way. However I could never duplicate the sound even on the same bump if I were too ride over it again on purpose. They called and everything was fine until the very end they found what appears to be a tiny hairline crack in the frame on the bottom of the headtube. I'm to pick it up tomorrow morning and then drop it off at a local Scott dealer for a possible warranty replacement.

So I ask...
1. Is this a common CR1 problem? When researching this bike prior to purchase I never ran across this as an issue. One guy at the dealership led me to believe it was. The Scott dealer (with a vested interest of course) said it isn't to his knowledge.

2. If it isn't a crack in the frame, what else if anything could it be? paint? scratch? is there a way for a carbon frame novice as myself to tell?

3. If Scott does replace the frame under warranty (What I'm told could likely happen)..... As it's a 2012 model what do they replace it with? A current team frame that with 2013/14 color which I'm not really a fan of. Has anyone encountered this? Can I try and push for a say CR1 Elite frame if I like the colors better as I'm thinking otherwise the frame is the same. Sans defect of course.....

Thanks for the help.

Gladius

I've got the same bike (2012). I'll be interested to hear what you find out/what happens.

halfspeed

Forum member @terrymorse has a business leading tours and renting Scott CR1s so he probably has as much experience with them as anyone. It wouldn't hurt to PM him.

BTW, if you're in the bay area and need a bike, there's not a more professionally run bicycle rental business anywhere. https://www.udcbikerental.com/

ds650

So Scott acknowledged the cracked headtube and has offered to replace my 2012 CR1 team frame with a 2013 CR1 Pro frame.

I'd rather have the exact replacement but the 2013 frame color is a flat grey & white so I guess that will match the white of the seat, bar tape and cables.

himespau 

Bummer that it's broken, but good to hear they're sticking by their warranty.

nesdog

FWIW, I'm told the CR1 frame is the same throughout the line...team, pro, etc. All that changes are components.

ds650

The CR1 frame is the same except the top model I think. (The Pro is 2nd from the top?) Its a different Carbon or something. So this frame should be the same as mine, except instead of glossy white & black its flat grey & white. Which is fine, the white will work with my white parts.

As far as Scott standing by their bikes they are..... kind of. Since I took it to a more local dealer than the one I purchased it from (I bought from a dealer further away to save $700 on a left over model) Scott wont pay the labor for the change over. So thats $100. I complained and the bike store met me at $60. Now today the person I spoke with said $100. This mind you on a bike that got its first miles just two months ago.

I need to call Scott district or regional office and speak with someone as I find that ridiculous. They ought to be embarrassed enough that they would pay the labor to any dealer to fix a defective frame. They should realize instead of selling Scott accessories or other items those hours at the store they are now spending hours repairing a bike instead of improving one. Hopefully someone higher up at Scott as higher standards than the person who is shipping the frame.

RoadTire 

I just read an article last week about a study done by (can't remember) one of the major carbon bike mfg's - they discovered subtle headtube damage like you describe when the boxed bike is dropped upside down and the impact is on the headtube. I just cannot find that link or article now.

SpeshulEd 

Cervelo.

MUZE

It was Cervelo and they talked about fork failure. The post is still on the first page of the 41

bt

it was damage to the fork steerer.

ds650

According to Scott the warranty is only 100% through the original dealer. The original dealer did specify only them on warranty issues. If I were still there I'm out zero dollars. In this case or in the case of a store closure, dealer brand drop, personal move through job transfer etc that makes the original store unavailable then the owner of the defective product pays for the change over charge. So I guess you better love and trust the dealer you buy it from and also never accept a new job offer or move for scenery change etc. I guess I'm just tired of most companies (read upper management) producing faulty products and shrugging their shoulders about it while they laugh all the way to the bank. There are a few good companies out there that have what it takes to stand behind what they sell, trouble is it's so rare to find one.

Terex

After dealing with Scott on a crash replacement for my CR1 SL, I'm all for buying your tech a brewski and getting on with your life.

wheelreason

No, there are 2 warranties when you purchase a new bike from an authorized dealer. The manufacturer's warranty, and the dealer's warranty. While the legalese varies from manufacturer to manufacturer, essentially they say the same thing. They cover defects in materials and workmanship for a specified period. The product must be shipped to them for inspection at owner's expense, the expense to swap out parts is also not covered. Competition, stunt, yada yada, voids your warranty, etc, etc. So legally, that's what they are liable for, that's the bad news, the good news is that often the dealer will absorb some or all of the labor costs for bikes purchased from them. Additionally, if a dealer does any kind of volume with a given manufacturer, they have a lot of say with warranty issues. I know I've had, let's just say questionable warranty frames, where I'll ask the rep to warranty it, and its done. Its about relationships, like the ones you don't develop with bike shops 2 hours away.

pdxtex

hey OP, sorry about your frame, hope you and SCOTT sort it out. concerning the labor costs to build up the warantee frame, think of it this way, you didnt make the purchase from the closer shop, so the way they see it, they didnt receive a dime from the initial sale. its probably scotts policy to warantee the actually product and not the cost of a build process. had you brought it back to the shop that built the bike up in the first place, they probably would have done the swap for free. new/closer shop, probably not. id say they are in the right for charging you labor.

ds650

Its not a "probably" they would cover it at an original point of sale. Its a certainty. At least thats what Scott told me.

The problem is it's ridiculous that any of the reasons I posted that if you do not or cannot return to the original point of sale than the original you are on the hook for the change over labor. The whole issue with the "other" bike shop doing the labor and not getting paid is not the case. I should not be paying the labor. I did not make the faulty product. The fact is Scott should be paying the labor cost to the dealer, it's their mistake. The dealer also didn't make the product. It's no different for example than GM paying a dealership the labor hours on a warranty item, I don't pay the labor to replace say an alternator while GM only replaces the part. GM pays both expenses. I'm still going to call higher up at Scott and hope someone there has what it takes to stand behind their product.

As for some of you that seem OK with being bent over a barrel by companies (and I'm guessing persons) I truly feel sorry for you. Yes I'm the guy at Best Buy returning $700 cell phones because they aren't 100% as good as claimed. I'm the guy getting $25 a month off my internet bill for 12 straight months because of one day of downtime. I'm the guy calling automakers 5,000 miles after warranties and still getting it covered along with calling the district manager of the dealerships so its done in the next 24 hours.

Just stand up for yourselves. Get that feeling in your gut, know that you the customer are right and ask that these types of items are addressed. Stop letting people & companies walk all over you. It makes you look foolish and weak and only gives them the confidence to do it to the next guy and guy after him. I don't always get what I want and sometimes I gotta call 2 or 3 times. (Customer Service Representative Roulette) But I can't imagine how terrible it must feel to just accept the first answer and bow down to everyone you meet. How do you do it? How do you have such little confidence and low personal value of yourself? I will not settle for that. We all have different standards I guess. I'm just shocked to see the way some people allow themselves to be walked on.

bt

ds650

If you like getting walked on go ahead and let others steamroll you. I have no personal interest in the way others take your money from you, or even the way in which you see yourself as less of a person to stand on even ground with those that walk on you. I'm merely greatly confused people allow themselves to have others dictate to them where they stand in relation. To many people like myself that would be an unfulfilling way of life, to many others like yourself it appears however there are the followers that need led and put in place.

SpeshulEd 

Ya know, I love screwing over corporate america just as much as the next guy, but if you truly are the guy that does the above, you're an *******. Sorry. You, the customer, are wrong. In fact, most times the customer is wrong. A warranty has terms and conditions, you knew (or should have known) them when you bought the product. Trying to get whatever fixed under that warranty, after said warranty is expired, is a ******y move. If you didn't know what a $700 cell phone was capable of before purchasing it, you're an idiot consumer. And did that one day of downtime really cost you $300, probably not.

Honestly, you were the type of person that I loved to deal with, because no matter how much you *****ed or threw your temper tantrum, I stood there with a smile on my face and told you no, and damn, if it didn't make me feel better.

bt

Zef

This thread is interesting as it seems like Scott knows some of their products have problems but do not do anything to inform their customers.

Case in point: In 2010 I bought a Scott Spark full suspension mountain bike that I mostly used for commuting. Two years later the military moved me and after moving and unboxing/reassembling the bike I was experiencing a weird sensation of my rear wheel slipping while riding on the roads near my house. Upon inspection I found that the right chainstay had sheared through a few inches behind the bottom bracket by the chainstay bridge. Living overseas I had difficulty finding a Scott dealership that could/would help with this so I contacted Scott directly. They informed me that they had a batch of frames that had an overheated weld and they were all failing in the same area as my frame. I phoned the shop I bought it from to find out if they knew about this and said it was the first they had heard of it. Scott sent me a new chainstay assembly which I was able to easily bolt in place (thankfully this was a fullsuspension bike otherwise it would have required a total teardown/rebuild and a new frame). After purchasing my bike I had registered it with Scott so although I am thankful that they warrantied the broken part of the frame I still find it very disconcerting that they did not reach out to customers or the shops that sell their bikes to let them know some of them had a problem. Had I deployed and the bike put in storage for a year and found the problem down the road the warranty would have expired and I would have either been fighting with Scott or looking for a new frame. The issue the OP has experienced confirms, in my mind, that there is a systemic issue with Scott as a company knowing about problems with their problem but not taking the responsibiliy to do anything about the problems unless the customer presses the issue. I wonder how many folks have gotten screwed on something that should have been a warranty issue that Scott should have recalled to prevent the failure of a problem frame/part.

-j

ds650

Greenfeildja, This is the whole point of the post. Even if some of these customers were taken by Scott (or other corps or individuals) they just accept it no questions asked because they are weak people who have low standards and little personal value of themselves. Something that seems foreign to me. It's nice to see I don't stand alone on demanding wrongs be made right, hopefully in all aspects you continue to stand up for yourself. Its easy to be a keyboard warrior like others on this thread like this while everyone in real life kicks your teeth out. I truly feel sorry for those types because life isn't fair, why make it even harder.

On researching Scott bikes before purchase I ran across threads discussing some Scott models of mountain bikes having frame issues. I wasn't looking into that model line of bikes so although I was surprised to see the issues I thought since there aren't multiple posts on the models I was looking at I'd be safe. The dealer told me that his GF rode Scott mountain bikes and was only a small 5'2" woman and broke three frames. After the dealing with Scott she now rides Giant. So far no issues. It would appear she was more of a man than others in this thread.

ds650

This post shows exactly the type of water brain you are.

1. I've already stated what the dealer told me. If he told me wrong, forgetful or less than forthcoming, thats not on me.
2. If I take my vehicle to a dealer because of something I feel something is wrong and they declare it fine only to go bad after the warranty that again isn't my fault. They made the wrong call and although it's now out of warranty they are responsible for not addressing my concern at an earlier time. That's how it works.
3. The cell phone features were explained to me be the salesman. I also read many reviews, some good some bad. When the person who sells it to me tells me the bad reviews are by people who hate the brand that's his fault for propping his phone up. All he needed to say was "you may find that to be the case." Once again not my issue, that's his fault.
4. The day of downtime didn't cost me $300. In fact it didn't cost me $3. But I pay for service 24/7 and I didn't receive it. Therefor my ISP to their credit made it right. That's how two adults work things out. One of them doesn't just get walked on.

It's a damn shame you don't have what it takes to stand up to other people.

And once again you show your stupidity. I don't throw temper tantrums. That's not my style. I simply ask questions, ask that my views be taken into account and considered. If that doesn't work I continue to move up the ladder. Sometimes I win sometimes I don't. But to lose full-time everytime like you seem to accept I just couldn't do.

You remind me of the moron smug service guy at the car dealer who said I'd have to pay for everything and that they couldn't get my car in for a week so they could rent me a car on top of my service fee. After just a 5 minute call to the district office my Jeep was in the shop just 30min minutes later and done the next day.

That's how it's done. For once in your life be a man and stand up for yourself. The feeling alone is worth a 5 or 10 minute phone call. The savings of money are just a bonus. Or continue to let other people walk on you. It's your choice, I'm just surprised at the animosity towards people that have what it takes to question situations. I'm guessing the sting of being picked last in gym class never left. I'm sorry that happened.

diggy488

ds650,

I get where you're coming from. I'd expect labor to be covered too. Hope it works out for you.

rpenmanparker 

To get back to the thread topic just for a moment, I would say to OP that your experience of not being able to get the exact year model as a replacement for the defective frame is the norm. Frame warranties have no clause in them requiring the matching of paint schemes and graphics. Trying to do so would be incredibly impractical.

Now returning to your rant about your superior assertiveness, you seem to think you can make the warranty (a legal agreement between buyer and customer) be anything you want it to be. If labor isn't included in the manufacturer's warranty well then it becomes a negotiation between you and Scott. Maybe they value your business enough to comp something they are not legally required to but maybe they don't. Asking can't hurt. The trouble with feelings of entitlement are that some of them are valid, and some of them are not. It is important to see the difference. Being a butthole about it beyond that point really can't hurt either. Trouble is, that is an irreversible condition.