Tacfarinas

Hi,

The Pennsylvania DOT has a website advocating what I believe is that standard doctrine about narrow roads: take the middle of the lane. The main advantage of this, aside from the fact that the road is better and the car doors more easily avoidable, is that cars and really big trucks are not encouraged to "share" the lane with you. So I tried it.

It's led so some pretty aggravating situations, with drivers leaning on their horns under the impression, obviously, that you're doing it to slow them down. (Like all brain surgeons and supreme court justices, their time is obviously very important.)

On top of that, I actually worry more than anything else that people drive without actually looking in front of them. That may be (slightly) irrational, and I've never seen anyone mow a cyclist down just because they weren't looking, but I've certainly seen them ignore stop signs because they weren't looking (as opposed to not caring), so lately I've moved back to the side of the road.

Unless there's a major information campaign and general change in attitude I can't actually see the middle of the road position ever being really that viable in this country. For the side of the road position to work all (?) you really need is something to get people to give you your rightful three feet of space. The only solutions I can think of are (a) again, a public awareness campaign (b) those flag / lollipop things (c) jerseys with "give me three feet please" on them.

Does anyone have any better ideas? I don't suppose the Leader of the Free World reads the fora. Pity.

intrepidbiker

I used to cycle in Western Pennsylvania and would take the lane. It all depends on the circumstances. If you've got several cars behind you waiting to pass, I usually pull over and let 'em.... A single car can wait a few seconds to where they could pass me like they would a car (i.e. change lanes to pass).

apricissimus 

I think riding that riding as far right in the lane as is safe is the best option. It gives the motorist a better chance to pass you and lessens ill will from motorists. Also, it just makes sense since a bicycle doesn't need the whole lane.

Yeah I've had drivers pass a little too close on my left, but is taking the whole lane really going to change that? If anything, it makes them have to move more into the left lane than they normally would, which can be dicey for motorists.

mandovoodoo

I suspect everyone makes the risk management decisions they're comfortable with. I generally ride in the middle of lanes, but there's usually no cars. When a car approaches I get as far right as comfortable, which is generally the right tire tread path. Gives me some right side runout room to accommodate idiots, encourages prompt safe passing. Some people will pass close, some will pass on blind curves, some will pass into obvious oncoming traffic driving the oncoming car into the ditch and me off the road (this has happened). I can't control them, just be ready! And having 4" of road to my right isn't being ready! But I don't necessarily need to clearly "take" the lane to control it.

UnsafeAlpine

Motorcyclists don't need the entire lane either.

I've started taking the lane in certain circumstances. Around here, even in rush hour, I haven't encountered any ill-will from drivers, but the only times I do it are on a 4 lane road. I've greatly limited the number of close passes that have occured to me, and I feel a lot safer on those roads.

genec

While I do agree with taking the lane when the road is narrow... and I do it every time I use the only connecting road for my neighborhood to the east and west... a 2 lane 35MPH road lined with parked cars, I have often encountered "ill will from driver" even though they could easily pass me by using the other lane. One time it was almost comical as the ratty haired lady behind me started honking and yelling and a driver the next lane over joined in to the fray.

I am of the strong opinion that a pubic service campaign similar to the safe boating campaigns I hear often are the key here. More and more people are hitting the roads on bikes as gas prices continue to rise. There should be a wide campaign to educate both drivers and cyclists on how to share the road. Just saying "share the road" doesn't get the message across... it is time for actual demonstrations of the hows and whys of taking a lane and what it means to all road users.

apricissimus 

True, but motorcycles can keep pace with cars thus causing them no inconvenience, whereas cyclists usually cannot.

The corollary to this is that I have no qualms about taking the lane when I can keep pace the car traffic.

CommuterRun

How wide are these lanes?

Some of the 2 lane roads I ride have 12' lanes, some narrower. While, legally, I could take the center of these lanes all the time, I don't. Instead I take a road position that makes it blatantly clear that I have the entire right half of the right lane. This gives same direction passing motorists the other 3/4 of the road, but makes it plain that they will have to, at least partially, change lanes to pass. Motorcycles can pass in the left tire track of the lane.

I will take the center of the lane in the event of traffic approaching from rear and the front when a motorist passing me will interfere with a motorist approaching from the opposite direction. Some are stupid enough to do it anyway. I don't worry about what I can't control. Also when one motorist appears to possibly be about to attempt a pass as they are passing me going the other direction.

genec

I have no qualms about taking the lane when motorists have alternative lanes to use.

Treespeed

grayloon

Safe boating programs do little to improve boating safety. As typical with other personal endeavors not requiring licensing, only those who have a bent toward doing things right listen or take courses that improve safe boating. Enforcement works best.

gcottay

For me it all depends on the room and the traffic. If the lane is narrow enough to share with a vehicle, I share. If the lane is too narrow, I ride center lane or even center left. When a long line gathers, which does not often happen, I will take the first safe and convenient opportunity to get out of the way.

The only thing that gets me is the combination of narrow lanes, high speed traffic, and bad sight distances. I avoid those roads even though some are attractive for riding.

Longfemur

You're always going to have problems implementing the "taking the lane" idea if you're not yourself moving at a decent speed that isn't too much slower than the traffic. This is why most people in the know recommend a road bike. You need a fast, quick accelerating bike and a fast rider to be able to do the kind of "traffic jamming" this requires. It's easy to take the lane under many urban riding situations, but you can't really do this effectively unless it's a fairly short distance, like a temporary lane narrowing, a sudden row of parked cars on a narrow road, etc. A proper road bike with a good rider on it can easily get up to fast enough speeds in most urban areas (excluding multi-lane arterial type roads which are almost like freeways). You can easily be going as fast as most of the slower drivers.

But if you can't do it safely, then don't.

cudak888 

+1. Those who do know maritime rules can relay stories that parallel those of wrong-way cyclist encounters. After all, it really is too much to expect the same idiot, when placed behind a helm of a sailboat or jet-ski, to have read boating/waterway manuals.

Here's something basic: "Red, right, return." Ask most folks on the water that fundamental question, and I dare say you'll be greeted with some blank stares.

-Kurt

genec

How about something as basic as "bikes belong on the roads."

CommuterRun

Don't leave out the powerboaters. I've seen more problems caused by them, as a group, than all other groups combined. I think the type of people that have problems with sharing the road with other vehicles when driving, are much more likely to own a powerboat than any other type of watercraft.

Bekologist

therin lies the failures of 'take the lane' vehicular cycling advice- its geared towards able bodied, speedy cyclists on a road bike-

slow riders can expect much more motorist friction when riding slowly claiming the lane.

genec

I think the problem lies in the unabashed use of power, whether in a boat or in a car... careful control of either by the operator is a good thing... wanton use of power otherwise leads to problems. Using power as a brute force to solve conflicts whether minor or major leads to problems... it is not the power but the lack of control.

crhilton

I just wish someone would get the ball rolling on that. I'd donate. It's definitely a worthy cause in my best interests!

If they're just going to be ******** "share the road" commercials than I'd want no part of it. You know, something stupid and inflammatory like the seat belt and anti-drug campaigns.

genec

The real issue is, there is no "someone."

In California for boating there is a Department of Boating and Waterways, and nationally there is the Coast Guard, but I know of no such state or national agency specifically for cycling. The Coast Guard even offers safety and training classes.

But there is no equivalent agency for cycling.

Certainly not the Department of MOTOR vehicles? National Hiway and Transportation?? Department of Transportation?? The latter does do statistics on cyclists... and pipelines.

But I know of no government agency whose primary goal is the promotion of safe cycling as transportation.

John E

It is more specifically geared to situations with a manageable speed differential between cyclists and motorists. When grinding up a steep hill at jogging speed with a posted speed limit of, say, 50mph / 80kph, I ride closer to the curb than I do when descending the same hill at 30mph / 50kph.

Speed differential likewise is the only reason I am so concerned about free merges, diverges, and merges -- in a 15mph / 25kph traffic circle, they are no problem, but they make life pretty miserable for cyclsts and pedestrians on 50mph / 80kph prime arterials.

CommuterRun

I agree. I have given it some thought, and there are very strong parallels between a bike and cars on the highway and a canoe or kayak and powerboats on the area rivers. Heck, even out on the bay if the boat operator is a real pinhead.

Which has led to the conclusion that, unless they are directly behind me, I'm not so sure I like them slowing down. I want them to hurry up and pass and get away from me.

CommuterRun

https://www.bikeleague.org/programs/e...on/courses.php

The League of American Bicyclists teaches Motorist Education in their Bike Education program. The problem is getting people to take the class if it's not a requirement. I think this course should be required for all new Driver Licenses and all renewals.

CommuterRun

I disagree. On a 50+ mph highway there's not enough difference in speed between a fast cyclist on a road bike and me on my Townie to matter to speeding drivers. Either cyclist should command at least the entire right half of the lane.

mandovoodoo

I think you're right. The basic education messages we need to get across are the basic rules of the road. I suspect that a range of 15 second TV spots would gradually change the base knowledge of what to do when seeing a bike. And for cyclists, how to ride.

The wrong way boaters are pretty much a danger. I had several encounters today with folks who seemed completely unpredictable. I tend to drive on the water as if I'm running a commercial craft. Doesn't seem to make much dent in the average weekend boater's level of competence! The bass fishermen are good. They're on the water lots and behave well. It's the ski and small cruiser drivers that are nuts.

red right returning. We had a crew mess that up after drinking at a local waterfront place. They did red left, went up an inlet at a goodly clip. Knocked down a few trees. I think 3 of the 4 were killed.