willawingwong

Hey guys,

Do any of you have any recommendations on a good fork for touring that also has mid-rack eyelets?

I currently have a titanium frame with an Enve 2.0 1-1/8th" straight steerer, 45 rake. Great fork, but not suitable for front racks.

I'm thinking of something I can find new or used for around $200. The requirements would be 1-1/8th" steerer, 700c wheels, mount for caliper brakes, mid-rack eyelets and eyelets by the QR.

2nd question: What would be an appropriate rake to get for a front loaded bike that would wouldn't be deterimental to handling. I would have a loaded rear rack as well. My headtube angle is 72.3 deg and it would be a 55cm frame. Also, I don't intend to have a handlebar bag.

Thanks!

tarwheel 

Check Soma, they have a lot of nice forks. I bought one of their cross forks for less than $100 thru my bike shop with mid-fork eyelets and fender mounts, but it is designed for canti brakes.

willawingwong

Ah thanks for the suggestion. I checked their website but didn't look like they had a caliper brake option with mid-rack eyelets.

fietsbob

IDK what the rake is on Asian forks To keep the steering, Trail, similar to what you have

Also, you need to keep the blade length, and the off set, in the ball part of what you have ..

Why do you want side pull caliper brakes ? just curious ..

do you have a steel fork to hire the braze on done & repainted ..

Or just get a pair of Ortlieb made Adapter mounts LM-1

https://www.ortliebusa.com/prodInfo.asp?pid=295&cid=3


& Lastly can't you reduce the load to not need a fork rack at all ?

willawingwong

Why do you mention asian forks? Ultegra 6800 caliper brakes are what is on my bike currently so I'd rather not buy new brakes. Plus the brakes are pretty amazing. I'd use the touring fork for touring and change back to my carbon Enve fork for regular use for lighter weight and comfort. It doesn't have canti mounts.

Those adapter mounts aren't recommended for carbon forks which is what the Enve fork I mentioned is.

Yeah, I can reduce the load, but that's not the plan.

I'm just looking for a fork that I can change out whenever I plan to go touring.

fietsbob

Buy a Bike trailer , and you wont need a rear rack either ..

Hire a custom builder and the fork made can be every thing you wish.

Bruce Gordon, in Petaluma California, is a custom frame builder who also makes about the best Touring racks .

(I've owned a set of his racks for 20+ years, [but not one of his bikes..])

so, .. I recommend having him make you that fork .. with the fittings ,
and buy one of his Low Rider racks



Re Asia. most Bike stuff is out of TW/ROC or CN/PRC at the price points people are wanting to pay

willawingwong

Ah I see what you are saying on the asian forks.

Thanks about the custom fork, I'll look into it.

The bike trailer is definitely an option. I was considering the Extrawheel Trailer but also wanted to look at available forks to see what my options were. For travel handling and ease, I would prefer a fork though.

tarwheel 

Your question piqued my curiosity. Most touring bikes have cantilever or disc brakes, or long-reach calipers (57 mm or larger). Thus you will probably have difficulty finding a fork with mid-rack eyelets that is designed for a bike with regular caliper brakes. Even finding such a fork for a bike with long-reach brakes could be problematic. So you have several options:

- Get a custom fork made by Gunnar, Waterford, Wound Up or other frame maker. A Gunnar fork would probably be the cheapest, but would still cost you about $300-350.
- Put a cross or touring fork on your bike and switch to canti brakes in the front. This also would provide more stopping power as well as clearance for larger tires and fenders. You could get a nice Soma cross fork for about $100 and Tektro 720 canti brake for about $25.
- Add a small Nitto front rack, which wouldn't support panniers but could be used to hold a small racktop bag. Soma an Velo-Orange sell similar racks that may be less expensive than the Nitto. Some of these racks are designed for bikes with canti brakes, but the Rivendell Mark's rack will fit a regular fork.

willawingwong

Tarwheel, based on my difficulty in finding an off the shelf fork to meet my needs, I think you are right.

If I get a fork for canti brakes, do they work with any levers? I have Ultegra 6700 levers. Not sure if canti-brakes also need correct cable pull ratios like caliper brakes. I recall now that I have some Avid SD-5R canti's in a storage box when I pulled them off my moutain bike after converting to disc.

I'm guessing another option would be to find myself a steel fork for caliper brakes and have eyelets welded or brazed on to them.

cycle_maven

You can adjust the cable pull ratio of canti brakes somewhat by adjusting the length of the straddle cable- but for the most part, canti brakes are about right for road levers. Most cyclocross bikes have canti brakes and road levers. A big advantage of a touring fork with canti brakes is that it can take wider tires; typical road forks and brake combinations, especially short-reach brakes, are limited to maybe 28 mm before they rub.

But you'll also need something to hang the brake cable from: Origin8 Brake Hole Mount Cable Hanger - Front

tarwheel 

I have several bikes with canti brakes and Dura-Ace STI levers. They work fine. The Ritchey Breakaway has a Soma cross/touring fork that cost $95 through my bike shop and has mid-fork mounts as well as double eyelets at dropouts. It is a very nice riding and handling fork, with clearance for fenders and large tires (35s pictured).

tarwheel 

I presume that your bike is not a touring frame based on your questions about forks. Simply adding a touring fork with mounts for a front rack might not work in the long run because your frame is probably not designed to handle the extra weight.

My Bob Jackson IS a touring bike with stouter tubing, longer chain stays, and mounts for fenders and racks. However, it handled very poorly the first time I tried to take a loaded trip because I had all of the weight in the back. Basically the bike felt like it was fishtailing and wobbling. Installing a front rack and panniers so I could distribute the weight better solved the problem. I just finished a trip using only the rear panniers and a small handlebar bag, but I carefully packed so that I was only carrying about 20 lbs of gear in the rear panniers. My point is that you might find that your frame is wobbly and handles poorly if you load it down with front and rear panniers, if it is not designed to carry that much weight. Distributing the weight between the front and rear will certainly help in that regard, and you might be just fine if you keep the weights reasonable, but your tubing might not be stout enough to handle the extra weight.

fietsbob

Just saying .. need more data.. a straight blade fork gets its offset at the top

what the angle of the blades are welded into the steerer tube at the crown is ..


Other way to do it bend the fork blades ..



head tube angle line hits the ground ahead of the vertical. Plumb line through your axle, that's the trail.

trail determines the way the steering feels ..

changing the fork blade length raises or lowers the Head tube, changing the angle.

Of course N+1 is always the solution New Bike built to be a touring bike , in the 1st place.

willawingwong

Thanks guys! I'll make that an option to look at.

Yeah, I don't plan to put a ton of weight on it. Just some light touring. And because it was not a touring frame is part of the reason why I wanted to get front and rear racks to help distribute the load for better handling. I've got a 32mm O.D. top tube and 40mm O.D titanium downtube with both having 0.9mm walls. I think those are decent size diameters. I don't know if that is considered thin walled though. A steel touring bike would certainly be stronger.


What would be considered a good trail to have for a lightly loaded bike with front and rear panniers but no handlebar bag? My trail currently is 58mm which feels fine to me. It was 53 before when I had a 50mm rake fork. It felt too twitchy for me. I've read going with a lower trail helps when your front end is loaded. But I don't know what a good trail number to target would be in this scenario.

Haha, yeah N+1 is great. Actually, my # of bikes have gone from 5 and soon to be 3 in just the last two months...if I could start over, I would've gone with a touring bike. This was just supposed to be a travel bike that I had S&S couplers put on to do supported rides with. It is just now that I decided I may want to try some touring.

cycle_maven

I've heard that about 50 mm is good for front trail when carrying front panniers. The load dampens the twitchiness. But truthfully, I haven't really felt much difference with a 5mm change in trail.

Also, with a Ti bike, I'd get a rear rack that mounts on the skewers rather than using p-clamps on the stays. Plus that will put the rack further back, which will help with heel strike.

willawingwong

Thanks! I got eyelets welded to the seat stays and the dropouts so no need for p-clamps. I haven't tested out the heel strike though...so I may need a rack that puts the panniers further back or adapters to place the rack further back.

MassiveD

You can buy whole touring frames and forks for what even some medium price forks costsay 125-200. Equip them with a few MTB cast-offs and you have a specific bike or frameset.

You can get decent cantis for under twenty, so it would be cheaper, and possibly safer to run the fork and brake combo than going for a custom fork.

fietsbob

That is a question for people that actually built the bike framesets ..


order a subscription to Vintage Bicycle quarterly

In Print, they seem to study that .

Nothing more than a HB Bag more trail , like your 58 ^^ may be fine.
steering feel a bit heavy? drop back to a bit less.

The VBQ followers have looked at the French Porteur Bikes

which carry a load over the front wheel and say shorter tail is better..


FWIW My Brompton & Bike Friday , small wheels , shorter trail, handle good with a load in front .

MassiveD

There were some enormous threads on porteurs and trail a few years back. Seemed as though it all worked. Or more accurately there was some load that carried well with some trail. The wild card is rack design and load distribution. I have front racks that carry the load back a bit towards the rear of the front wheel very stable arrangement, and quite different than the regular concentric pattern. And something similar can be achieved with weight positioning.

The average touring bike today is 73 degree head tube, and 45mm offset.

• Trail 60mm
  
• Wheel Flop 17mm
  
• Mechanical Trail 57mm
  

cycle_maven

Regarding N+1: A craigslist unsuspended mountain bike (80's rockhopper, antelope) would have the right brakes, gearing, everything for just about the cost of a new fork ($100).

ct-vt-trekker

Lots of options with Surly forks.
Forks | Parts and Accessories | Surly Bikes

I bought the Long Haul Trucker fork for my Ritchey Breakaway Cross for about $80 online, I think it only comes in black. This one has the same rake and axle to crown dimensions as the original Ritchey carbon fork so it was a perfect match for my bike.