thanks for everyone's opinions. Banzai, the info on the shimano hubs sold me. I ended up getting the dura ace 7900 hubs with Open Pro rims. 28/32 spoke 14/15/14. Colorado Cyclist's threw in a 10% discount. Weight is around 1700 grams. CC builds an excellent wheel. I wanted more info on how they were built and the guy indicated it was proprietary info. Not sure if that was hype or they have a superior way of building. I suspect it is handbuilt, then machine stressed, then de-stressed and adjusted. The sales guy assured me I would not be disappointed and I am not. I don't have a lot of miles on them yet, but the Dura Ace hubs are super quiet and smooth as butter. I think they match my 853 steel bike better than the bling of Ksyriums.