Originally Posted by
Malloric
Except for the fact that they are not inaccessible to you. Get a bicycle. The only thing that is not, at least in America, are the Interstates and some highways which are mostly funded by gas taxes anyway. The Roman pleb walking on the highway to the market to buy his daily gruel isn't much different than the American driving on I5 to Wal-Mart. And note, the Romans banned vehicles in many cities during the day. The merchant with his ox cart had to come in at night. We have no such restrictions here on commerce, although they have been proposed. Vacationing Roman nobles and wealthy merchants used the public high roads to travel as did the common classes. The difference was the common classes could not readily afford to travel whereas they can now. As such there was a greater public interest in the roads as a means of bringing goods to the people and less public interest in bringing the people to the goods than we have today. That doesn't mean commerce was exclusive or even had a priority. In cities roads often banned vehicles (commercial) traffic during the day so that people could more easily use the public roads for whatever private use they desired without "heavy" commercial traffic clogging up the roads. There's no philosophical difference between public roads now and public roads then. The difference is mobility. Society is more mobile in every way. Instead of 5% of the population traveling rarely, 95% of the population travels frequently. Same holds true for commerce. I seriously doubt the average Roman got his eggs from a hundred miles a way. That's not uncommon now.
If by domain you mean use, well yes it joins a long laundry list of public services that are used by individuals. Libraries, schools, museums, parks, public transportation. Is your point that governments should not spend tax dollars on public transportation? No spending on roads that's for personal use, but more on public transportation because it's for personal use? Err, okay. Logic, unnecessary much? Or did you just not have a point beyond your apparent believe that Roman roads weren't used for personal travel? If making up fallacies about Romans helps you ignore the fact that cyclists in America were an instrumental (in fact for many years the instrumental) driving force behind an expansive public road network go right ahead.
I know this might be a novel concept but society does not revolve around "many of us" (and by many, we're referring to the very small minority that cannot afford a car). The narrow interests of a self-declared "class" do not and will not trump the majority interest. I view buses as you do roads. Gigantic, inaccessible wastes of tax payer dollars. My two feet are generally quicker, so why the hell would I pay for a bus with my tax dollars. Still, despite the fact that buses as used in America are not good for the environment, not economical, and not practical when compared with even inefficient personal automobiles, society apparently feels they are worth funding at levels I don't feel are justified. That doesn't mean I'm making up some hoopla about class warfare or drawing up imaginary "us versus them" lines in the playground and it doesn't mean I'm anti-bus. I'm just anti-buses that don't make sense. I also happen to think roads should be paid for by usage fees and not unrelated taxes on property, sales, or income. Society doesn't agree with me there either. Go figure. Who would have imagined a country of 300+ million wouldn't conform itself to me me me?
You're going to have to stop switching which roads that magical gas tax is paying for...
Too bad everyday isn't more like this(the way it sounds you envision it) because maybe then i would tend to agree:
Unfortunately the reality is many public roads are not accessible to cyclists because they're too dangerous or no thought was given to a cyclist so no shoulder or lane exists. Many subdivisions are no longer required to place sidewalks for your speedy two feet to walk down. The list goes on and it seems clear most roads are designed for private automobiles and their use - In fact these road improvements may indeed have been started in America by cyclists(in the 1800s I think), but it was quickly usurped by the automobile movement in the early 1900s. For you to conclude that cyclists running the Good Roads moment had what we currently have for roads as being with the spirit of their movement ignores too much of the physical differences between cars and bicycles. Though you did tell me buses were the new pick-up trucks... so I wonder if you think all these things are interchangeable in a more then symbolic sense.
Where the philosophical difference arises from, is the fact more classes are now able to afford the use of a highway in the same manner nobility was. The accompanying disinterest in bringing "goods" to the public is debilitating for the rest. This seemingly small fact that you brushed over results in a very different taxation and use pattern. Almost all road taxing and spending is put towards the private domain of the car. The public spending to enable private vehicle use dwarfs the amount required to obtain the benefits for only the public domain(buses, goods transport). You didn't think through the idea of something being "public" yet still being inaccessible for many. Do your nice library, parks and museums require $20,000 set of "car" keys to use? How does your logic go there: It is public and any citizen who pays $20,000 can use it. Sounds a lot more like something private to me, particularly in light of the fact our lower classes are growing(even though they still like to think they're middle income).
I know from your rant against "wah wah i'm poor" you feel everybody can afford a car, what is $20,000 after all, but you'd be dead wrong. If you read the original article, many families are either forced into eating spam sandwiches because the transmission breaks or simply banished to the under serviced ghettos because they can't keep up car payments and lose their job 40km away. After all what good is a person who can't be privately mobile for 40km? Seems we just write them off if they can't seem to bootstrap up(something becoming less of an option). Maybe you can try to understand why the car is an instrumental force in the class warfare going on under our democracy. The private car and it's expensive sprawling roadways which suck dollars from public transit, hospitals, libraries and all the other truly public services the citizen needs come to be a yoke for keeping people of a certain income from crossing a line on the playground as you put it.