Titmawz, i was trying to send u a message but cant until this newbie write 48 more post lol, anyway thanks for letting me know about sunday ride, a friend and I just started doing road bike, we are getting better every ride, but right now we are bit slow for those group ride, we do about 20-21 miles, do you have a link or map with the route that can check where u guys ride. Thanks again for letting me know.