Pretty much the same people, same arguments - that I have read for 13 years now. Few, if any, are ever convinced otherwise from their original beliefs.
Perhaps the listserv computer program should be programmed so that helmets shows as "h*****s"??
And, somehow, the argument always manages to turn to attacks on people and their other beliefs, locations, whatever, rather than on the specific arguments about whether or not and how effective h*****s are, and should they be required or not.