Originally Posted by
Jerrys88
To answer your questions, I would say I always need my 12 speeds - typically use them every time I ride. I'm the kind of rider who likes to maintain a cadence, and I prefer to climb hills slowly in low gears (I'm not a strong rider).
What bothers me is the nagging feeling that I'm working too hard to go up hills. Part of it is that I think in the lower gears the Schlumpf Drive creates so much torque that if I'm not careful to pedal with very smoothly-applied pressure going up hill, then I get a "springy" feeling that feels like part of my energy is being wasted in compressing the suspension rather than all of it efficiently rotating the tires. It's hard for me to put into words. Add to that the nagging feeling that instead of minimizing the weight of the bike, I've been "forced" to go down a path that has maximized it's weight, first with the weight of the Schlumpf drive, trying give a bike 12 gears that wasn't designed for it, and also by adding the back rack which I felt was necessary because early on normal "parking" caused the back plastic fender to crack and I felt it was likely to happen again, plus the bike rolls so much better with the 4 wheels the rack provides.
One intriguing bike an NYCeWheels rep has suggested is the Tern Verge X20 - a bike with 20 speeds weighing only 20.5 lbs (vs. my 30 lb. Brompton). I can't help wondering if such a drastic reduction in weight might make it tolerable to carry such a bike in and out of stores, and that the difference in weight PLUS the fact that it is DESIGNED with the gearing I seek might make the tradeoff (not rollable like Brompton) worth it for a huge boost in performance. BTW, When I say that I typically go into stores, I don't mean carrying it in a big store or mall and doing a lot of walking with it, but rather running into a 7-11 or deli or relatively small fruit and vegetable store to pick something up to eat, although I have been known to go into a Target and rather large Whole Foods store to pick stuff up. The Tern Verge X20 is VERY expensive, though, so I'd really have to be pretty impressed by the improved performance and sold on what it feels like to carry short distances to seriously consider it (and I'd probably have to sell my Brompton to afford it).
The less expensive and only slightly heavier Tern Verge X10 (21.3 lbs. - hideously color-schemed IMO) has fewer gears than I want, but then if the bike is substantially lighter than my Brompton, and if the drivetrain doesn't suffer from lost energy like my Schlumpf-driven Brompton does, then I may not need quite the low range I have on the Brompton. All of this can only be determined through test-riding, which I think is my next step.
Re Tikit - I had long conversation with BF rep about a number of their bikes, but we talked about so many different bikes and configurations that I don't remember exactly what conclusion we came to about it - have to review my notes. I'll revisit that as well.
Thanks for everyone's comments.
To me, it sounded like you are wanting a 20" GI low gear as a start; probably an 18" or a 16" to climb steep hills, because you are indicating to us that you were using a smaller chain ring than the 44T. I don't know what kind of hills you are climbing, but if you need anything lower than 25" GI, then I guess you have some nasty 10% to 22% grade hills in your area? If that's the case, none of the stock bikes are made to provide you with anything lower than a 20" Gear Inches (GI). Typically, a relatively strong rider can deal with a 28" or 26" gear on up to a 16% grade hill (that's steep) and that's why it's on pretty much most road bikes. To get lower, you really need a smaller chain ring and a 11-34 or 36 rear cassette combined to get you really low. I have a 21" GI low gear on my Dahon Mu SL, but I had to customize it with a SRAM 11-34 cassette and a 53/39 road double crankset up front to give me a 21" to 90" GI. I have a front derailleur attached with a ThorUSA gadget so I can switch between the chain rings using a shifter. The Mu SL only comes with a 9 speed and is the older version of the Tern Verge X10. With a 21" gear, I can literally spin up a 22% grade piece of cake. With a loaded trailer and panniers, I can manage somewhat. But anything lower than 20" GI, I would probably be better off walking than cycling. To get lower, I can replace the road double with a double compact crank 50/34 to go down to a 18" with a 82" GI high.
Remember that it's not the number of gears, but what are those gear inches to you that will maintain a good cycling cadence without the gear redundancies found on 27 and 30 speeds bikes! Just because you have lots of gears do not mean you are going to use them. This is the most common fallacy for people who are wanting lower gears! Wrong approach. Best approach is to find your lowest gears that you like and approach it as a 1x9x2 or 1x10x2 system. I have a 1x9x2 system on my Dahon Mu SL (note that I do not mention that I have 18 speeds) and a 1x10x2 system on my Masi cross bike. The advantage of this system is that, I always have a good chain line, quick shifting without having to resort to those long cage derailleurs and it will NOT JAM on the up or downshift during stressful steep climbing sessions because I don't have to shift from one chain ring to another to go lower.