Originally Posted by
mrbubbles
Thank you.
Originally Posted by
mrbubbles
Many people can spend $1000 on a bicycle but won't spend more than $50 on lights. If you want to compare dyno system to quality battery system, quality battery system still wins in the economics department, $100 can get you a decent setup from light and motion, cygolite, that's brighter than any dyno system in the $200-300 range.
Yes, but as I said MANY people do spend quite a bit on battery lights and THOSE would be good candidates for the benefit of dyno lighting. As to you last statement, while true it is superfluous. There is such a thing as bright enough (particularly when the light is applied where it is needed); however, I am tired of explaining that to the more is always better crowd.
Originally Posted by
mrbubbles
Just face it, dynamo system is expensive compared to battery, they're very expensive compared to the new offerings from China. People who buy dyno system (like you and me) don't care about the cost, the convenience factor trumps the cost. I have 3 dynamo setups, and 3 battery systems, my cheapest dynamo setup is more expensive than my 3 battery system combined. Frankly, imo, people who ride often at night but won't get dynamo systems are just cheapskates, it's so much more convenient.
Yes, german or japanese made quality products are much more expensive than cheap chinese products produced with slave labor. If price is one's primary concern then by all means purchase $25 lights from the Chinese.
Originally Posted by
mrbubbles
I've also tested a commercial dynamo taillight (herrmans h-track, which apparently
one tester say is brighter than the popular b&m toplight plus) on my bike, imo they suck really really bad (that means your fender mounted Spanninga taillight is crap too), I'm still going to supplement it with a Planet Bike Superflash and a 3w cree red led flashlight. No commercial dynamo taillights are reasonable acceptable in my view, except a diy using cree xr-e red led with standlight, that mofo is bright.
Your wrong about which tail light I own, but frankly your past 'testing' is ludicrous considering you don't do it objectively... "Yeh, bubba, I think the one on the right is brighter..."
Originally Posted by
cyccommute
Um...no. $25 is a lot less than $200, no matter how you cut it. Sure some people pay a lot more for their battery lights. At this point in the game, I can't see what they are getting for 10 times as much money.
Yes it is clear that you can't understand why people might prefer something beyond cheap Chinese lights.
Originally Posted by
cyccommute
If you know that the batteries have different chemistry, then you should understand how the batteries react to different conditions. One of the trade offs for that high energy density and low weight is increased delicacy. My bikes are ready to ride at as much of a moments notice as yours are. I get the battery off the charger (three of them, actually), plug them into the lights and ride. It takes longer to put my shoes on, especially in the winter when I have to wear shoe covers.
You simply don't get it. I don't care what the chemistry of the battery is, no does any consumer. We want the products to work as they are reasonably expected to. For a product that is intended to be used outdoors that means getting left outdoors (or at best in a garage). Many electric cars use similar battery chemistry to those batteries used for bicycle lights (lithium...) Do you expect their owners to remove those battery packs after every use and store and charge them inside? Of course not, doing so with bike light batteries IS CODLING them. When treated as most will, they don't last much longer than 2 years for the best quality ones.
And while you may not believe you need to spend much time getting your bike ready to ride, your simply mistaken. That you have to spend ANY time to get the bike (or yourself) ready for a ride is more time than I need to spend. I can just hop on and ride (granted I do have to open the garage door). Further, I can take as long a ride at night as I choose with no need to concern myself that I don't have enough battery power for my lights...
Unless you always ride with a full nights worth of battery power for your lights YOU CAN'T SAY THAT.
Originally Posted by
cyccommute
Reflectors, by their nature, are passive devices. They don't work unless light hits them and the light has to hit them from a fairly narrow angle to reflect back to the source of the light. Laws of optics, angle of incidence/angle of reflection and all that. DOT approved reflectors (seemingly) bend those laws but the laws still apply. I would rather have an active light that overwelms the reflector than augments it.
Sorry, but with their frensel nature, the angle bicycle reflectors work is quite wide, hardly laser beam like as your implying, perhaps you need to review your college level optics. And NO BICYCLE LIGHT overwhelms the light from reflectors, especially in the day time... Cars still have more light, especially as they adopt the same updated LED light sources. Since cars will ALWAYS have more power available for the light than any cyclist is going to carry.
Originally Posted by
cyccommute
Um, again...no. More laws of physics. Light intensity falls off with the square of the distance from the source. Light traveling from a source to hit a reflector has to return to the source so the intensity is reduced even further by the time it returns back to the source. And not all of the light is reflected back so that's a huge reduction of a tiny fraction of the light. Assuming a standard bicycle reflector of around 8 square inches (2"x4" reflector), that's 0.005 sq meters of reflecting surface. That's hardly enough reflecting surface to "shine brighter than ANY bicycle light".
Yes, yes, yes, Clearly you will believe what you want. Yes the light reflected is less bright than its original source... However, given that the sources are far brighter than ANY bike light, my point is still accurate...
Originally Posted by
cyccommute
Google them like I did. You'll find all kinds of them.
Your so kind! FYI, I did google and couldn't find anything but flash lights at those prices. The cheapest Magic Lights I found were more than twice that price.
Originally Posted by
cyccommute
I have to disagree that I'm just a cheapskate. The lights I choose to use are chosen because of their output and utility. I've been doing this night time dance for 30+ years and I don't choose lights frivolously. There's a lot of thought that goes into my light choices.
Cheapskate isn't nescessarily an appropriate description, but by your own admission price is a major component of your decision making on the subject. Well that and your a Tim Allen type.
Originally Posted by
cyccommute
Quite frankly, the output of even the best LED is still only a fraction of an overvolted halogen. I used to run MR16 12 volt halogen overvolted to 14.4 V and they would throw out 3 times what any single Cree XML T6 puts out. Considering that the halogen had the same run time (about 3 hours) on a 4.5 ahr battery as the LEDs I'm currently using, I considering going back to them.
Well by a litteral definition of fraction you are correct. After all the sun's output is only a fraction of a candles output.
Originally Posted by
cyccommute
In the last 5 years, dyno have started to do much better compared to the old incandescent lamps and a little bit better compared to halogens but other lights have gotten better as well. Even if I don't use the $25 Cree lights and bought Magic Shines, I can still buy more light output for less money than a single dynamo system. That's not being cheap, that's being economical.
Dyno headlights (since all three technologies still used dyno's for power) offer significantly greater light output than the older technology. Your statements otherwise indicate you are simply irrational on the subject.
And yes, no one disagrees that battery lighting can output MORE light than dyno lighting. As you say the reason is based upon physics. battery lighting has far more power available than any dyno system. Again, you and Tim Allen are wrong. More power isn't necessarily better.