I completely agree with the "old school" approach. You have to take off the chain to get it clean. I had the Park version of the clamp-on chain cleaner gizmo, and I would use clean solvent every time and really run that chain through it over and over, and it never got all the grit out. I could still hear grit in the chain by holding it in two places about a foot apart, and twisting it. The grit gets suspended in the solvent and brushes, which just flush it repeatedly back into the chain rollers. If you take the chain off and put it into a container full of water-based solvent, like Simple Green or Pedro's, you can shake the bejeezus out of it (or get an orbital sander) to get all that stuff out, and then run it under a strong water stream to rinse out all the loose particles and degreaser. I dry mine with towels and a hair dryer to get the water off ASAP, and then use Pro-link. I live in a *very* sandy place, (nickname: Sandy Eggo), and my chains are immaculate. I have 1000 miles on a SRAM PC-68, and there is *no* sign of wear on it. But I don't go to all this trouble just to prolong the life of my chain, that's not the point. The point is that as your chain wears, it lengthens, and hastens the wear on your entire drivetrain. So all this diligence is to preserve my drivetrain. And that's worth the trouble. Once you have the routine down, it takes about 10 minutes start to finish. Less time than the clamp-on cleaner, and results in a cleaner chain, *without* getting solvent all over you, your bike, in your hubs, etc etc.