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Old 01-18-14, 11:17 AM
  #16  
genec
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Originally Posted by buzzman
Really. It's just so futile to engage in any discussion wth you because you are so well practiced at obfuscating any topic with time worn jargon, heavily biased and condescending social theories and dogmatic adeherence to your own narrow point of view. We could lock horns on several points in your post but time would wind on and the landscape continue to change under under our feet without us having altered one another's opinion in the least.

When I first came on BF's, and Serge was still holding court as Helmet Head, the disputes were largely about lane positioning and vehicular strategies. Now HH, long since banned, VC moved to its own sub-forum, and any hint of VC gets a thread relegated to the rarified atmosphere of said sub-forum.

In other words, the reality is that discussions of this type have been severely marginalized. Why? Because they are counter productive at best. The wrangling goes on but threads tend to be less and less about lane position and more and more about types of infrastructure and what serves us best.

I have no desire to allow myself to be marginalized out of the discussion and creating allies, even among those with whom I may not always agree, is just good politics. And bike advocacy is, like it or not, a political game.


Now it's a wonderful wish that those of us who ride according to the rules of the road fare best but personal experience tells me that while I may adhere to the rules of the road the drivers around me may not. On my daily commute I much prefer my somewhat longer bike path ride along the river to my "on streets route", in large part I prefer this route because I have the least interactions with automobiles. But when I take the streets route I am reminded as I look over at passing automobiles or as I pass them alongside in the bike lane how many are texting, "Multi-tasking" (cell phone in hand, lap top in lap, coffee in other hand and steering wheel manipulated by the knees or other wise distracted by some form of technology or other. How do those changes in the landscape of driving since the 1970's alter your perception of the "fear of overtaking traffic"- or do you simply dismiss this new reality because it doesn't serve the theory?

And if cyclists like me, with hundreds of thousands of miles of cycling under his belt, having ridden in all but two of all the states in the US, in every Canadian Province, lived, cycled and toured in several European countries and cities is dumped in the bin of those with childish notions of cycling and an irrational fear of overtaking traffic because I've grown fond of certain bike facilities and am open to the possibilities of new designs then I am only too happy to count them as my allies.

In the meantime, the great irony of A&S is that those who post most frequently in opposition to separated facilities and with the most fervor as to our rights to the road also create threads like those I have linked below. Or like Eli Damon ride with cameras to catch every poor motorist interaction and yet regale us with claims that "cyclists fare best..."

Not that I have not had my own battles with motorists, some of which I take no pride in, but if being separated from traffic reduces these kinds of incidents then I much prefer it.


http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...-with-motorist

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...3-USPS-drivers

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...rant-motorists

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/920325-Hmmmmm


http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...-Rude-Motorist
Very nicely stated... I especially like the part in bold above. I too have to ask if cyclists like me with 10s of thousands of miles under my belt (perhaps 100 thousand... but I have not kept accurate record) also seek separated paths over "sharing the road" then perhaps there is some other underlying reason besides the psychological aspect so often thrown out by some here.
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