Have bike, will travel
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Lake Geneva, WI
Posts: 12,284
Bikes: Ridley Helium SLX, Canyon Endurance SL, De Rosa Professional, Eddy Merckx Corsa Extra, Schwinn Paramount (1 painted, 1 chrome), Peugeot PX10, Serotta Nova X, Simoncini Cyclocross Special, Raleigh Roker, Pedal Force CG2 and CX2
Mentioned: 46 Post(s)
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Putting it more clearly, when we speak of neutral handling in automobiles, we're referring to the interaction between steering and vehicle yaw angle. With bicycles, we're referring how steering interacts with vehicle lean angle. Most cyclists don't yaw their bikes in turns, but we all lean them.
It was mistake to introduce the comparison of bike trail angles with car caster angles. Where I was heading was that car caster angles don't directly affect yaw angles, whereas bike trail angles directly effect lean angles, or rather how we achieve, hold, then straighten from them. While what I was meaning to differentiate was automotive use of neutral (yaw) vs. cycling usage of neutral (lean).
Back to the OP, the differing amount of trail in my bikes don't seem to greatly affect how the bike plows, pushes, or understeers (choose your term) in loose stuff, whereas weight transfer does, and to a significant degree in my experience. Trail does effect how my bikes track over bumpy surfaces.
Both the automobile and the bicycle can be tuned to handle. On a bike: wheelbase, bottom bracket drop, trail, and other factors produce a variety of outcomes. The automobile designer must consider weight distribution, wheel camber, anti-roll bars, springs and other factors. It would be a mistake to discount one specification just to make a rhetorical statement.
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When I ride my bike I feel free and happy and strong. I'm liberated from the usual nonsense of day to day life. Solid, dependable, silent, my bike is my horse, my fighter jet, my island, my friend. Together we will conquer that hill and thereafter the world.
Last edited by Barrettscv; 03-29-14 at 03:09 AM.