Originally Posted by
MassiveD
I think the idea is good, and to boot, I would love it if we had a separate thread, stickied, not only for this, but for pictures of custom bikes. Within reason the pics could even be of home made customs, basically anything custom.
I agree the numbers would be impossible, though one other approach is the NAHBS approach which is like 5 year sin the business. Imperfect, but there are some flashes in the pan. Would I rather see a guy who has been building for 25 years but doesn't have a web presence, than a guy with a great site who has only a few bikes under his belt.
Also, there is the whole Rob English kind of deal. I doubt he has made 100 bikes custom, though he may very well have. I don't know if he is 5 years around. But he has an engineering background, and worked at a high level at Bike Friday. He did it the best way. Also, his racing background is really invaluable, even to tourists. He probably isn't technically eligible for the list, which is a huge mistake. Basically if there is a good reason for putting someone on the list, the reasons or boxes ticked don't mater.
That is a little weird, because there really isn't a huge custom bike builder business outside of the frames. It seems to be better business to sell complete bikes, but the bike biz is all fractured into parts suppliers, virtually nobody makes bikes.
It probably is a good idea to have various models, but I don't think it is a useful idea to require that. If there was a guy out there making a success of selling only one model, who are we to second guess the market? There may be people who serve niches, or people who have no models and never make the same thing twice, or not so often they have a model. I really don't see that as being anything we need to regulate. And there are people who tour on MTBS or Racing bikes, why should that be a forbidden model.
I agree 100% that a great touring bike builder should be on the list even if they don't have a website, but there has to be some record or evidence (produced within customer's touring journals, etc.) that tourers have found success with their bike(s).
Not sure we are on the same page with regards to builders supplying a complete touring bike. Many build up complete bikes. I'm not saying that these builders fabricate saddles and parts, just that they assemble and fit them for the customer. A lot of tourers simply don't have the knowledge, resources and or time to take a frameset and build it up. While they could take the custom touring frameset to one of their local bike shops, if so, they've now introduced another environment to the final build of their touring bike. That approach won't be ideal for many but it won't be right to exclude builders who have a long history of building great touring frames alone.
Rob English: Man, I hope he pulls off something great with regards to English Cycles and certainly I hope that includes a touring bike or two. Having worked for many years for Bike Friday, having toured coast to coast, and given his creativity… but within your many choices within his custom bikes drop down, "Touring Bikes" isn't one of them. I'll probably give him a call and ask about that. Again, this list is based on already proven framesets. That's no travesty or crime because a good builder will not live an die by this list. It's a fair standard to have at least one well documented touring bike toured on by a customer or two before being included here.