I said tension was key, my quibble was over the OP's suggestion that detensioning followed by tensioning achieved anything, assuming that the wheel was non-insanely enough built that one could go forward and didn't have to tear it apart. I should be more careful, I am not really saying the OP suggested it, but trying to avoid people taking that impression.

I like to do about 4 steps, and it would take me more than a minute, plus it often results in having to further adjust tension and true the wheel. But it is not all that difficult, though the fact it is easy and fast has nothing to do with how important it is.

Jobst said the only part that actually mattered was tweaking the parallel pairs, so on that basis it would be pretty fast + retuning.

I don't have any hard data on this but the data we do have indicates that most hand built wheels that pros, built, often where they don't check each spoke with a meter will have considerable variability in tension in them. Yet these wheels often stand up super well, but if they weren't stress relieved they don't. I don't have much of an opinion on that, but it may be the case that stress reieving is more important than being Joe Park Tensionmeter. As a guy who only does his own wheels I am Joe Park Tensionmeter, because I don't have the feel to wing it. All put together it is one of the reasons why a newb can make a really good wheel, if more slowly.

A further reason the guy with the uneven spokes may none the less build a superior wheel (OT but interesting) is because he taco checks his work, while the current method is to factory specs. This is a long subject but the tensionmeter method can be at a lower stress level.


The fact that not all spokes fit hubs well, etc... Using a proven formula is a simple solution. Even custom makers run into this problem, and it is universal enough that we have for instance the spoke washers. Most factory wheels I have come across can be dark on hubs, spokes, and nipples, normally the brand part is the rim only. I am talking $1100 kind of normally all good bikes. These happy price point bikes are often built with only the big name parts on the places they feel customers look. Nipples for instance what brand are they. And to be frank, how do I know they are the brand they say they are. Even US military planes have counterfeit components in them.

Citation please. I actually don't doubt you can find one. But the contrary to that is I am the heavy rider, and I have until a few years back never owned a butted spoke bike, and never broken a spoke. The evidence I go by is that the guys like peter white, and virtually every maker of serious bikes that aren't bespoke level, use straight spokes. Peter guarantees his wheels, and has been in business for decades. He will not build all kinds of wheels he thinks are stupid (and I don't doubt he thinks butted are better), but those are the facts. Straight spokes don't break.

Further, all the bad wheels are pretty much built using straight spokes, so you get all the imaginable problems in straight spoke land. Who pays for Alpine III but gets them done by machine, and tensioned by a monkey? This is part of the straight spoke myth, they break because the wheels are badly built, not because the spokes are a problem. This is why pro built straight spoke wheels can be guaranteed.

Further: 1) stronger means nothing in the real world. I can build you a stronger Boeing 777, it might be too heavy to take off though. What maters is are the spokes strong enough, and the answer is more than strong enough for anything we ever do. 2) BUT, that is mainly relative to fatigue failure, that is only one failure mode, in other failure modes straight spokes may be stronger. 3) There can be places where straight are better, in the rear half and half, for instance.

The half radial rear wheel can be a lot stronger. And if one doesn't want radial one can use either a different gage or straight spokes. So even assuming the nonsense butted are so great... It turns out the rear wheel only needs to be half that way. Most sensible people will give you a pass on the front wheel because it is rarely the place spokes break. So out of say 72, or 80 spokes, you can get away with as few as 18 spokes, butted, no mater what happy talk you believe about butted spokes.

According to Jobst, who wrote the book, you can get a good 500000 miles (or maybe K) out of spokes. He did. This is the main point, his butted spokes were more durable, but I, and maybe all the people I know, will probably not together do 500K on the same hubs and spokes, we are fine with straight spokes. Jobst, being Jobst, bought up a lifetime supply of MA2 rims, and just switched them out. As an engineer, he believed that when properly built the only spokes that would break were defective ones. You replace those, it made no sense in his mind to discard proven spokes for ones that were unproven. Things people blame on spokes, constructing elaborate theories, are probably mostly defects, once those are selected out, you want to keep and run the good spokes. Of course the process for that is not entirely simple.

The thing the armchair experts never say is how much better butted spokes are. Give me a number. Do they last twice as long? That would be a preposterous. But even if true, I can make spokes that will only allow me to cycle around the world 10 times work for me.