View Single Post
Old 11-29-15, 03:11 PM
  #103  
Maelochs
Senior Member
 
Maelochs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 15,492

Bikes: 2015 Workswell 066, 2017 Workswell 093, 2014 Dawes Sheila, 1983 Cannondale 500, 1984 Raleigh Olympian, 2007 Cannondale Rize 4, 2017 Fuji Sportif 1 LE

Mentioned: 144 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7653 Post(s)
Liked 3,479 Times in 1,836 Posts
My opinion sort of matches the Supreme Court's in this case ... citizens are considered to be A.) sovereign and B.)m innocent unless facts indicate otherwise, and thus have no reason to need to identify themselves on demand with a government-issued photo ID.

It all depends on whether you start from a point of the basic individual being free and voluntarily conjoining with others to form a community, or consider the community to be more important than the rights of the individual.

Considering that the nation of The United States of America was founded upon and was about the first major nation to encode the Rights of the Individual in its formative document, I'd say individual freedom is the hallmark feature of the nation, and alternate views are pretty basically un-American.

The police officer is a Public Servant and as such has no power over any citizen except when that citizen surrenders his right to legal protection by breaking the law. The idea that we should all bow down or bend over for LEOs ... well, certain posters here sound very much like the offspring or in some way relatives of LEOs, which is all good. Whatever.

As I have said repeatedly, I respect LEOs in general, and accept that in the specific they are just human beings with all the attendant faults and flaws, strengths and weaknesses, and they are often placed in high-stress situations, and also, that they tend to be doing a job I really do want done (that is, protecting me, my stuff, and all my loved ones and the social structure which allows all of us to live such free lives.)

On the other other hand, there is that apocryphal Ben Franklin quote about those who surrender liberty for safety get neither.

Rather a cogent sig, bhchdh.
Maelochs is offline