Originally Posted by MassiveD

Your bias is showing, the cranks may be better, you have already ruled them out with the correct conclusion that as the price steepens the return in performance does not, but that is true of current default appropriate bikes like the Surly. My wife toured happily on a 40 dollar bike for one whole summer before I met her. In going up to 1K plus bikes nobody is having a better time. Nothing broke.


Yes, my bias is showing. I prefer to see a real tangible increase in performance before outlaying large amounts of cash rather than the "if it cost more it must be better argument". I also just toured on a bike that I bought for $55 dollars. Nothing broke either.

Tautology

I suppose fancy words are better, even if others have to look them up to participate in a discussion. However, in my case I have provided logical examples of why I think the way I do so if you want to argue those fill your boots.

I don't doubt it, but that is sorta weird. There is this sense that there must be something wrong with people who recognize the value in certain gear, and pay up for it. But for others they would only pay up, if they won the lottery, a state that would for a moment make spending money seem like getting stuff for free. So value is revealed to some, only when there is no need to pay for it... Where do we end up when we assume that getting better is worthless? The flip side is people who hunger for the best stuff in the world, and get it, but end up with stuff that arguably is garbage and silly. It does seem to be hard to nail this one.

I am not saying I don't recognize the value in certain gear. For a TdF racer a CF crankset might be quite valuable. For a RAMM racer a CF bike might make a difference. Only that I also recognize when that value will or won't really effect me. I don't know your medical condition but I know that at my fitness level (not to bad really) and stage in touring a CF crank will not provide a tangible benefit to my performance based on the cost involved in gaining it. If I could buy one cheaper maybe it would? It really is that simple. I'm still active and riding bikes to the edge of what they can deliver before moving on within reason because touring is just one of many competing duties and hobbies. I'm not building a holy shrine to the most awesome bike anyone, anywhere, regardless of use can own. If I can get an small increase for a small price I accept it. If I get a small increase at a huge cost I don't. That's the value of stuff revealed when you actually have to pay for it.

So yes, you are correct in a sense that if I won the lottery I would buy fancy stuff, but not because it suddenly gained more value to me. It would be because money gained less value.

To add some perspective. I used to install and maintain salt water aquariums as a business and saw many many people with disposable incomes spend thousands on systems only to have me remove them several years later when the thrill was gone. I had one of the better reefs around created by their "gifts". I also scuba dive and see the same thing happening in shops all the time. Someone gets into it, gets talked into spending thousands on "life support", does a half a year or two of diving and sells it on CL. I have a lot of really good dive gear too because I network with a lot of divers and even write articles sometimes. People generally give me interesting stuff cheap or free because I'm a nice guy who also helps others and shows a real interest and passion about the sport and not just the stuff. They just walk up and give me stuff anyway and say things like "I saw this and thought of you". In both the above cases I've benefited by working hands on with numerous systems and am respected for offering real world experience to counter balance the "hype". I try to do the same with bikes.

I wouldn't say some material doesn't have value. Just that there is a time and place in ones spectrum of touring for it. People just starting out on moderate tours do not need expensive gear - they need experience. Then the experience will tell them what's of value and what's not.