Originally Posted by
Slaninar
This also won't happen. Don't take my word for it. If you have an old set, try doing it in one go. Lube it with any lube and try pushing it too far. Bolt will strip first.
The way to push the cranks too far is to put them on dry. They will get a bit (more) damage in the process. Then ride a bit, let the fretting do it's thing. Then re-tighten the bolts. And repeat that several times. Finally, the cranks will be pushed too far, resulting in a split crank interface if you go far enough.
You can do that even with lubed ones, of course. Just keep riding-re-tightening the bolts.
I didn't imply dry tapers
prevent anything, much less say so. (I don't speak in absolutes. I've been around bikes long enough not to do that.)
In your opinion, dry tapers make this more likely. I don't want to speak for Campagnolo and Barnett's, but seems in their opinion, they make it less likely. Since you admit it can happen either way, I'm going with them. No disrespect intended.
Originally Posted by
Slaninar
Some recommend lubing. Some recommend dry mounting. Bike industry, IMO, is mostly about marketing, which mostly relies on looks and low mass (weight). Good engineers are in auto and aeroplane industry.
Not in the bike repair industry, apparently....
Originally Posted by
Slaninar
I have quite strong hands. Never have I been able to tighten the bolts so that the cranks are split in one go, or they "climb" too high. Lubed, or not.
I never said it was a "one go" thing. It takes time. Fretting doesn't cause it, overtightening does. Greased tapers are more easily overtightened, which makes it more likely to happen faster.
Originally Posted by
Slaninar
So, at least mine, experience confirms what I've said. Could it all be wrong? I guess it's possible. Only after 20 more years could I claim my experience to have any sort of statistically valid value - it's about big numbers.
Luckily for you, Campagnolo has "big numbers" after making alloy cranks and square taper BBs for 60 years. Barnett's has "big numbers" after 30 years of instruction, and countless years of combined experience of their faculty. You don't have to wait twenty more years.
Originally Posted by
Slaninar
I still see no benefits in mounting them dry. Just (potential) problems.
You didn't appear to have acknowledged what I offered as "benefits" (which is a word I did not use.)
As I acknowledged, potential problems either way. The "benefit" is fewer long-term risks. Risk mitigation is playing the percentages.
I would say there is a sweet spot in the middle where it probably doesn't matter whether you grease or not. If you understand the risks and use the correct tools and torques, and adjust intelligently for your personal preference, things will probably be fine. How many home mechanics have either the tools or the knowledge? For that matter, how many shops do? That's why there are resources provided by manufacturers, and knowledge-gathering and instructional institutions like Sutherland's and Barnett's and UBI. Whether you choose to believe them or someone else like Jobst Brandt, well, that's a religious decision I suppose.
In the hands of a ham-fisted mechanic, whether professional or home, all bets are kind of off.
Originally Posted by
Slaninar
Why they wrote such manual is beyond me, really.
You said it, not me.