Originally Posted by
mstateglfr
nope, my reply is correct.
i said there are more than 'about 5' manufacturers of frames. There are more than 5, so that is correct.
i said that franes are significantly different in both geometry and tubing shape between brands and even within a brand. That too is correct.
as for that novel you typed out...
- yes, you clearly love fuji-ta.
- yes, you are clearly interested in frame manufacturing, as am i(especially the history).
-no, none of that disproved my earlier post.
Clearly there are more than 5 manufacturer's of frames, hundreds if not thousands in China but when it comes to good quality manufacturer's that most importers use in the US and Europe there aren't very many that produce entry level and above for good quality brands and those that produce the mid quality and above for lower end brands. They have to be fully certified safe frames for both markets not something many Chinese manufacturers can do for aluminium and carbon frames.
I mean there are something like 130 million bicycles manufactured in the world per year. Most of those are low end bikes for the Chinese domestic market, India and many poor countries and wouldn't be fuji-ta mostly. With fuji-ta making 20 million complete assembled bikes and a huge number of frames on top for other assemblers. It would be hard to make an accurate guess on how many aluminium bikes are based on a fuji-ta frame in the US and Europe, at worst it could be 20% I would guess but could be as high as 80%. Most shop brands for their mid-level and upwards bikes, brands like Cannondale, Raleigh, Vilano, Mongoose etc. Many famous European and US brands. If you split the difference and say 50% it's a staggering statistic really. Fuji--ta's Battle brand while significant in China does not sell huge numbers compared to the competition because the market is price dominated most of their production is exported. It is the cheapest bikes that are most likely not to be fuji-ta in the US and Europe and at the very premium end there is more competition. Fuji-ta dominate in the middle of the quality spectrum for aluminium frames.
No I don't love fuji-ta, clearly like most people I would prefer these bikes were made in Europe or the US, far too much is made in China and both the US and UK are running a large trade deficit. Many great cycling brands have been reduced to importers or the company has basically died and the brand resurrected by a importer. I try when possible to separate the importers from the real manufacturers. Many companies claim to be manufacturers when you can see they have simply rebranded a generic Chinese bike. It annoys me when an importer manipulates consumers by linking their current Chinese bikes with their heritage of manufacturing in either the US or Europe and then charge huge money on top. Unfortunately making high quality products in the US or Europe is expensive nowadays compared to the far east but fantastic products are available at the premium end.
The brand I have most respect for is Giant the Taiwanese giant of cycling. An actual manufacturer which makes fantastic quality frames and bikes. They seem to have a no compromise approach to quality which means sometimes you don't get the best fitted components for the money but I feel there is little better in frame quality at their price points. Most of the bikes they will be competing with are likely to be fuji-ta for aluminium at least although Giant are still an OEM for some aluminium frames, Canyon I think. Where as their carbon frames have been priced out by cheaper Carbon frame supplier's like fuji-ta and quest. Canyon and Trek is quest.