Originally Posted by TenGrainBread

Not following what that has to do with the issue I had with @clubman's argument. He was saying the difference between Japanese and Italian is a difference of "handmade" vs. "mass production". Yet there were clearly both types of bikes being made in both Europe and Japan regardless of the origin of the style of bike.

His quote: "Cino Cinelli made a few hundred bikes a year while I suspect the nameless/faceless Miyata production line could easily pop out those out in a day or a week."