Originally Posted by Leebo

Ugg. So you are 235 lbs and the loaded bike weighs 60+ lbs? Hmm. Riv touts the off road experience. A lot. My bike packing tires are 3,4 and 5 inches wide. Rim brakes? Not. Back to the discussion, no Riv for me until they go disc and 1/18th in head tube. What if I wanted to run a sus fork? Currently building up my 4th Surly. Gone through 3 sets of rims, worn out. Just no. You do a lot of steep gravel roads in VT? Not. You have no clue. This ain't no commute. The grey dirt snot constantly builds up everywhere. Including the rims. Dude, just no. Go buy a riv or 3. Just not my cup of tea, for me and my conditions that I ride in. Surly for life, bro.