Originally Posted by
DangerousDanR
Trevtassie:
it is unfortunate that too many people try to make criminal behavior into a political issue. Before I turned to software control systems to make a living, I studied economics. One of my classmates senior thesis was that crime is related to poverty. Unfortunately for him, he had to defend that thesis in class, and I pointed out that his numbers didn't indicate a correlation between crime and poverty. The professor teaching the class (who was also chief economic counsel to the Democratic House Ways and Means Committee chairman at the time) agreed that my numbers were compelling and that my classmate's thesis was faulty.
Look at the UK. Property crime is very high in London. Mean and median incomes are among the highest in the UK Glasgow is a fairly violent place, particularly by UK standards. If you go to the Outer Hebrides, you will find an area almost free of crime. They have the exact same social welfare systems, and there are a lot of poor people in the Hebrides. There is also a very strong sense of community, and there is almost no crime, and what there is mostly revolves around substance abuse.
I used to be a Fire/Medical responder in one of the most leftwing states in the US. The people I saw who did stupid and / or evil criminal acts were all fueled by alcohol and / or methamphetamine. Since I was in a very rural area I knew most of those people. Not all of them were poor.
Here in the state of North Dakota in the US, we have a politically conservative governor and legislature. When he took office Gov. Burgam made prison reform one of his signature issues. He made a speech in which he claimed that 95% of the male prisoners and 100% of the female prisoners had mental health and / or substance abuse issues, and that it was in the best interest of the state to deal with the underlying root cause instead of continuing with the status quo. The numbers were provided by the Department of Corrections. They are accurate.
They have added substance abuse treatment programs for both men and women. Burgum's next plan is to move the women's prison from a remote location to be closer to mental health services. The men's prisons are already in such a location. The main opposition to the move comes from the community where the prison is currently located, and the staff at the current facility. Everyone is in favor of the rest of the changes.
I know the family of an inmate who was convicted of an armed robbery who was placed in the program. He was one of the first to successfully complete the program, which is a couple of years in length. He is finishing his sentence working as a substance abuse counselor in the prison and intends to enroll in a university program to be able to work in the field when he is released. Yes, North Dakota will give him a license if he remains substance free and does not commit any additional crimes.
As far as the impact on Burgum politically? He won re-election Burgum: 66% Lentz 25% other: 9%, so I would say that it didn't hurt him very much.
Awesome, nothing like discounting years of research into the link between crime and poverty with a "when I was in college" story, Back to back with a anecdote of a single example. You'd do well in climate change denial. I do like your thesis that most crimes are fueled by mental health issues, it kind of confirms my belief that the USA is, overall 4 times crazier than Australia, since the incarceration rate there is 4 times that of Australia. Or could it be that poor people, in a country where there is no real social safety net end up in jail because they don't get treatment for mental health and substance abuse issues and where they have no hope of advancing themselves because there isn't socialised education past high school level? It's great that there is one conservative politician doing a better job, but you'd have to agree that Burgum isn't from the traditional republican background, and actually managed to reduce his vote from 75% to 66% for his second term, so being fair obviously doesn't appeal to all conservative voters.
Incidentally, I've been to to both London and the Outer Hebrides... pretty well the Outer Hebrides exports all it's potential crime to the mainland when youth moves away to get work. Just a whole bunch of old people walking to church on Sundays (yes, I drove on a Sunday and got scowled at). London still has 28% of it's population below the poverty line, incomes may be higher, but so are other costs like housing, which more than absorbs the difference.