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Old 02-07-23, 02:23 PM
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Stadjer
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Originally Posted by drlogik
Well stated, Stadjer,

I do have a follow-up question: considering The Netherlands is a master at harnessing water along with Venice, how do underground structures stay dry? I know Venice floods periodically, I was there when it did, from high tides, etc. How does your country manage the water for underground facilities and your low proximity to the ocean? From an outside observer it would seem to be a constant battle to stay out front.
Actually the biggest threat to Amsterdam is dryness, then air gets to the wooden poles the houses are build on and they start to rot. A few centimeters of water in the basement regularly is what many Amsterdammers have to deal with and this has to be explained to newcomers, don't put anyting directly on the basement floor. Another issue in mostly slightly dryer area's is 'inklinking' the soil is sinking though compacting, a process ever since it was made dry basically, but influenced by the favourite water height of the farmers. So there are competing interests often, That's all managed by 'waterboards', kind of democratic institutions that go back to the 1100's, but there are plans to give the farmers less of a prominent voice. This is also one reason many cycle paths aren't smooth asphalt, if the soil beneath is sinking the cobblestone cycle path won't crack, they just remove the cobblestones, put some sand on it and put the cobblestones back in, and the important traffic artery is operational again after half a days work. That is actually very important, Dutch infrastructure can't deal with much road works without getting congested somewhere else.

Venice's problem is actually quite different, because it's open to peacefull water, while the Netherlands exists as a country because it has been protected against the rough North Sea and it's storm floods. So the Netherland is protected by huge barriers, dunes, sea dikes and dams. That also has been build since the 1100's at least, but it's only been really safe since the Zuiderzee works in the North in the 1920's/30's and the Deltta works from the 1950's to 2000.
I haven't seen this video but this guy usually does well made, well researched video's. Another issue are the many rivers. Last year there was a flood in the South, near the German and Belgian border but not further down the Meuse. This is because of the 'room for the river' project that came about after more serious flooding in 1995. The Netherlands has stopped pushing rivers into a narrow and straigth bed, but gives them room and there are basins created where people use to live to handle the volume of water, it's still used for grazing and recreation when the water is at a normal level. Germany and Belgium were hit terribly by the flood because they don't have that, but of course just over the border we got a bit of their problem. Also in Rotterdam there are very low lying parking garages, squares and football pitches that simply will flood in case of extreme circumstances. The land is used, but might temporarily out of order, so not with housing are things that could be seriously damaged. Cars left in that garage will be write offs, but that's a small price to pay over many years.

In Venice with a high water level the Mediterranean just flows into the lagoon and then floods the unprotected city. The barrier doesn't seem to work that well. I suspect failing European integration is the cause in the sense that Italians had to do it, instead of calling the Dutch. I'm sorry but they are the most experienced and most expert, whether a ship is stuck in the Suez canal, or Dubai needs artificial islands, or New Orleans needs to be safe from floods, there's a whole Dutch industry to solve issues with water anywhere in the world, it's a business too and I don't know why the Italians didn't trust them with their national treasure. I'm not the least worried about the engineering in the Netherland, the main worry is complacency and administrative mismanagement, untimely maintenance, neglect and maybe some nice houses will have to go because when a dike has to be made higher, it has to become wider too.
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