Originally Posted by GamblerGORD53

That is just going from worst to not much better.
All mine are 75/ 80d. Seldom get numbness and never a tired back. Mine have 2.5 to 3.25" rise as well.
I do 100+ mile rides with ease. Never used bar tape. My top tubes are all 23 1/2" or more.
Damn I'm still wishing for another pair of these grips off a 70s Raleigh.