You don’t read so well do you? I explained why spokes are preformed to the hub and you said it was BS. I have never said that I don’t set spokes. I have broken tons of spokes despite setting them. You’ve claimed that I practice magical thinking but relying only on setting spokes and tension is equally as magical.

As to the co-op, professional mechanics on these forums use that as an ad hominem all the time. Here’s a clue: A 15 year old kid can be called a “professional” mechanic but he knows nothing about bicycles at all. How many bicycles have you worked on in the last 15 years? I’ve worked on north of 20,000…52 times a year, 6 work stands at a time, 6 hour shift, pushing through 30 people per day for 15 years. And the vast majority of those bikes have been bikes that shops won’t fix. In addition to that I teach classes on how to fix bikes and I teach people…including the professional mechanics on the retail side of the co-op…how to build wheels. I am not an amateur. The only difference between me and a very old mechanic is that I give away my knowledge and expertise rather than take pay for it.

And, on top of that, I’m a professional scientist who goes and investigates something before shooting off about it. Things like stainless steel being a pretty good spring material and how spokes are formed and the science behind why we do what we do in wheel building.

And, finally, if “we know that good wheels don’t break elbows” why are broken spokes a thing? Why are people, including SamSam77, always asking about it. Granted it’s not a problem for everyone but it is a problem for some and there are better solutions than saying “just increase the tension and bed the spokes”.