Originally Posted by
rekmeyata
I don't really give a schit what you do to your bike, how you ride it or maintain it, I posted evidence to show that they ideally should be lubed, and if you don't, not a big deal, you do you.
I have one bike from 1977, 5 from the 80's including the one with over 160,000 miles on it, 1 from 2013, and the last bike from 2023, they ALL have pivot points, and they all should be lubed, even the factory that makes them well tell you the same thing, and that is why bike shops lube the pivot points. But, like I said, I don't give a schit if you lube yours or not, I'm not the one that is riding your bike, just as you shouldn't give a schit if I lube mine.
Well you sure seemed to murder a whole lot of electrons to not care. You posted evidence that
you say shows that the derailer should be lubricated. I posted evidence that it doesn’t really matter. I have road bikes, touring bikes, and mountain bikes that get used hard. I’ve never worn out a derailer…front or rear.
Yes, car doors do start to creak and need to be greased using white lithium, this should be done every 12 months, this will help prevent wear on the pins, the latch, and latch mechanism. When I say every 12 months that is a preventive thing, the door isn't creaking yet but regreasing them will extend their life. Those parts on a door are pretty heavy duty, not like a derailleur, so if people don't grease them, they can last a long time, so just depends on how well you want to take care of an expensive car. If you have your car serviced at a dealership, most will apply a small amount of grease on that stuff without notifying you that they did it, but most will only do it if they hear noise, the problem once you hear noise that is due to metal on metal, same reason why people wait to hear noise from their chains before lubing when the reality is they should be lubing it before the noise starts.
I’ve been driving cars for longer than I’ve been riding bikes. I’m not sure how greasing the door hinges on a car will “extend their life” because I’ve never seen a door fall off a car due to hinge failure. I’d say millions of people don’t even know that the door
has hinges, much less lubricate them.
And, generally speaking, the noise you hear isn’t “metal on metal” but metal on metal
oxide, i.e. rust. The rust expands inside the joint and causes binding. It’s the same reason chains start to squeak.
Your chain uses pivots and rollers, see below:
You lube those don't you?
Nor nearly as often as some people think it needs to be done and I’m not convinced that lubrication with oil or wax does much of anything to reduce wear. Chains wear out with a surprisingly similar frequency independent of what you use to lubricate them.
Yet those parts are cousins to the same pivot parts in a derailleur, see below:
Those are all metal parts that need to be kept lube.
I’m confused as to what parts you are trying to show. Here’s an exploded view of a Shimano 600 and none of those parts above match up
What “pivot points” are you talking about?
Similar, yes, but they see a fraction of the movement and forces that the chain does. Cheese to chalk comparison.
But since you don't lube the derailleur pivots because there is no need, one can assume there is no need to lube the chain either...
Boy! I bet that straw man was easy to push over.
Shimano’s PDF “Service Instructions” for road and mountain-bike derailleurs all feature a chapter on lubrication. • Look under “Maintenance” → “Lubrication” → “Derailleur Pivots.” • Available for groupsets like 105, Ultegra, Dura-Ace (road) and Deore, SLX, XT (MTB).
SRAM’s technical manuals for Force, Rival, Red, XX1, X01, etc., include a “Periodic Service” section that calls out the B-link, P-knuckle and L-knuckle pivots—specifying oil type, drop-count, and interval.
Campagnolo publishes detailed workshop manuals (PDFs) for Super Record, Record, Chorus and Potenza. In the “Lubrication and Cleaning” chapter you’ll find a table listing each pivot and recommended lubricant.
This is the last I will comment on this with you, you have your way of doing things that do not line up with any manufacture recommendations, and that's all the manufacturers can do is to recommend; that is not any different from changing oil in a car engine, it is a manufacture recommendation to do it at X number of miles, if you don't want to change your engine oil, that's on you, all they're doing is recommending.
Shimano:shimano.com → Service → Download PDF (search by model: “RD-R8000 service instructions”)
SRAM:sram.com → Service & Support → Technical Documents → Derailleurs
Campagnolo:campagnolo.com → Customers → Technical Documents → Workshop Manuals
It’d be nice if you would include links to those manuals because I can’t find your examples at all.
This undated dealers’ manual for mountain bikes derailers doesn’t mention lubricating pivots.
This one specifically on SLX doesn’t mention lubricating pivot points.
This SRAM manual doesn’t mention lubricating pivot points.
This extensive article on rear derailer overhaul also doesn’t mention lubricating pivot points.
Perhaps the problem here is what is meant by a “pivot points”. I’m talking about the pivot points of the parallelogram because the A and B knuckle is best left alone. They may be able to be taken apart but getting them back together is difficult.