Originally Posted by bovine
An obvious authority.
Thank you
Originally Posted by bovine
Out of the 20 or so threads I've read regarding internal hubs, this is one of maybe 2 or 3 posts declaring that internal hubs have chronic upkeep issues. Most post I've read are somewhere along the lines of "Yeah, I just put some lube in it every 5 years or so and I'm good." My personal experience has been that internal hubs are almost maintenance free.
I don't think the Shimano Nexus 8 speed has been out on the market more than a few years, so people hardly "just put some lube in it every 5 years", and please notice that it is this particular hub I and the top-poster was talking about, not SRAM 7, or the Rohloff, or the legendary Torpedo T3.
[snip]
Originally Posted by bovine
Yep, the hub definately does weigh more than a cassette/hub. The thing is, if you're in the commuting forum, you probably want a bike that can maintain momentum. More weight on a wheel means a higher moment of inertia which means that the bike will coast much better than if it had a lighter wheel. The downside of course is that it will take more work to accelerate. Regardless, the difference isn't that great between cassette and internal acceleration/momentum.
I don't think that there are good arguments for heavy bikes, but I do think it is a matter of personal taste; some people commute on road bikes without fenders, some on heavy bikes with fenders, racks and mirrors. Personally I think bikes should be fun to ride, and while being no weight weenie, I do think that light bikes are more fun, and Nexus 8 rear wheels tend to be very heavy. A matter of personal taste of course, but none the less someone should take into consideration when thinking about getting a hub with internal gears.
Originally Posted by bovine
Let's see. $230 for the hub and shifter on Harris. And we all know how reasonable his prices are. [/sarcasm] Add a Shimano brake only lever for $50. You seem to think that The Nexus-8 isn't truly Ultegra level, so let's compare it to a 105 setup. $150 on nashbar for one shifter (assuming you want a single chainring up front for fairness' sake), $30 on nashbar for a 105 cassette (that you'll have to replace, compared to $10 for a new cog w/ the hub), ~$50 for a 105 hub, and $70 for a rear derailler. Internal $280, Cassette $300. Oh, enjoy the premium paid for your dished wheel too.
Hardly a fair comparison; for only $20 more you get very light, 10 speed race level goodness with crisp shifting action, compared to a heavy, city-bike level hub with a guaranteed extra drag due to construction.
I think a SRAM X-7 derailleur with a single SRAM X-7 trigger shifter, combined with 105/Ultegra hub, Tiagra cassette would be a more fair comparison; it would of course be a superior solution regarding gearing options, speed (drag) and weight, but probably also regarding price.
Originally Posted by bovine
Not as low maintenance as internal hubs. I do mind the dirt; it's a commuter and w/ internal I get to use a chain gaurd. As regarding affordability, see above.
Hubs with internal gears gets just as dirty as derailleurs, both needs cleaning if you want them to look good.
Regarding price, then I really do think it is hard to show that the Nexus 8 is cheaper than an external derailleur combo. But I don't care if you really believe that yourself.
Regarding maintenance, then there isn't any maintenance on an external derailleur besides cleaning and lubing.
Originally Posted by bovine
All personal opinion w/ nothing to back it up.
Look, I am not on a crusade against internal gear hubs, as I wrote, many people are happy with the particular model the top poster asked about. However, it is my conviction, that this particular hub isn't suited for being used "in anger, say 10k miles, all weather." to quote the top poster, or at least one has to maintain and service it with very regular intervals.
That internal gear hubs are inferior to external derailleurs in many respects, and have few, if any significant advantages is so obvious to me. For starters, then the extra drag is just a fact, not an opinion, so nothing to discuss there. I also think that price and weight is higher, though it is a question of personal taste if this matters, it is something worth considering.
My personal pet peeve with internal gear hubs are that they are marketed as "maintenance free". They aren't, but need regular maintenance and inspection if you want to ensure they work, just like any other bike part.
It is also my conviction, based on what I see and hear, that this particular hub model (or others in a comparable price range) have lesser quality bearings and sealing, than normal hubs and thus probably needs more regular service.
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Regards