I was about to say how disappointed I was that I missed this thread as it's right up my alley, but then I read it and quickly changed my mind.

My take on 953 (block your eyes, Classic1).....

It's only big advantage over Ti as far as I've managed to deduce scratching my head for 12 months is it's UTS. Since we don't see Ti failing left-right-and-centre, it solves a problem that doesn't exist. It's no lighter than a regular steel bike, it's not a stiff as Ti, it's not as corrosion resistant, it's not as light, and you have to heat treat the stuff post weld which adds lead time and cost.

When you add that all up and realise that it's within 10% of the cost of Ti to make, then you've got to ask, "What's in it for anyone?"

If you're an ultimate steel snob, it's the ultimate steel, and therefore probably the bike for you. But me personally, I just can't see a good reason why other than the kudos of having a frame that's really really strong. Doesn't seem to deter all the people buying Aluminium or the calls I get each week saying "Do you do Carbon repairs?", so all in all it doesn't really add up.

I'd also go so far to say that Columbus XCR will probably dominate over 953 because of their superior distribution and the fact that they're concentrating on the corrosion resistance side of things rather than the UTS, which nobody really cares about.

Now, one question I have to answer specifically was by Bikewise1....

"1) Can you present evidence that prefab CF seatstays are costlier to build with in a non custom, mass produced platform?
2) Can you present evidence that their inclusion creates an end product that is lighter, stronger and more durable than the material they replace? Or to throw you a bone, has any tangible, measurable, and desirable benefit whatsoever to the end user?'

1) Yes. They're more expensive to buy, you still have to cope them, and epoxy takes time to cure. And you have to do that in a jig which costs 7 grand and is just sitting there waiting for glue to dry.

2) Carbon stays are lighter. That's all. Everything else is annecdotal. To some that's all the performance gain required and worth the cost.