Riis Admits It!!!
#76
Senior Member
Originally Posted by rufvelo
Absolutely. Ban Riis for 4 yrs from running a pro team. So the deterrent is you can't get away today, or even 10 years later when if your not actively competing, you can't be intimately connected to the sport.
Practically everybody was and is doping! Get with the program... don't shoot the messenger!
#77
rider of small bicycles
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Rochester, New York
Posts: 1,687
Bikes: Cannondale
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
Originally Posted by botto
The fact that he went, and sat alongside, and confessed with Aldag shows a level of class that you don't see very much in the pro peloton.
Mark
#78
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 7,681
Bikes: Pedal Force QS3
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
Originally Posted by El Diablo Rojo
Look I'm huge fan of Zabel, but he didn't just come out of the big blue sky and confess. He knew, just like Riis, that he would eventually be implicated in the growing Telekom scandal. It was damage control plain and simple. Get your message out first and control the spin.
__________________
15% Hammer Nutrition Discount Code
15% Hammer Nutrition Discount Code
#79
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 1,960
Bikes: Cannondale R700 (2005)
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by rruff
WTF? You guys are crazy! Do you really think these gestapo tactics are the solution? Riders are coming forward and admitting... isn't this a good thing? You just want to drive it all underground again? If Riis was facing a 4 year ban he would deny forever (and so would everyone else) and nothing would ever get pinned on him.
Practically everybody was and is doping! Get with the program... don't shoot the messenger!
Practically everybody was and is doping! Get with the program... don't shoot the messenger!
This is why some of us think the best solution would be an amnesty period for past digressions, BUT, with that, the achknowledgement amongst current riders the need to submit to and implement MUCH more stringent anti-doping programs and controls.
#80
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Virginia Beach
Posts: 1,038
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
At this point in time what can they really do to Zabel? He admitted to doping for a week many years ago. If the WADA code had been in effect he would be free and clear as WADA limits itself to punishing dopers from only the past 8 years.
Riis should be similarly protected and his admission, while not endearing him to those that oppose doping, is virtually meaningless in the offical channels. He can't give up his TdF win regardless of what he does with the symbolic jersey of that win. However, he should be booted out of the sport, not as an official action of any governing body but as the intelligent move by the leadership of his team and by the sponsors. He is beyond tainted and should be alienated. He taints CSC, both the American company and the race team, with his guilt and associates both with a doper. Why would either want him around?
Riis should be similarly protected and his admission, while not endearing him to those that oppose doping, is virtually meaningless in the offical channels. He can't give up his TdF win regardless of what he does with the symbolic jersey of that win. However, he should be booted out of the sport, not as an official action of any governing body but as the intelligent move by the leadership of his team and by the sponsors. He is beyond tainted and should be alienated. He taints CSC, both the American company and the race team, with his guilt and associates both with a doper. Why would either want him around?
#81
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 4,201
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by rruff
WTF? You guys are crazy! Do you really think these gestapo tactics are the solution? Riders are coming forward and admitting... isn't this a good thing? You just want to drive it all underground again? If Riis was facing a 4 year ban he would deny forever (and so would everyone else) and nothing would ever get pinned on him.
Practically everybody was and is doping! Get with the program... don't shoot the messenger!
Practically everybody was and is doping! Get with the program... don't shoot the messenger!
And as I said in another related thread...
Only attractive amnesty deals, whistle blower deals, very harsh alternative choices, improved testing by agencies AND teams motivated by retaining sponsorship will help. Not rid the sport of the problem completely, but reduce the incidence.
However if you're caught a second time you're gone. Plus much less leniency for team management, team doctors etc. You just have to get tough.
OR
Decide to turn a blind eye and accept it as part of the sport. Thus continue to take a weak stand on it, assume everyone will be blood doping, EPO, testerone etc and to limit liability, do some minimal testing - only test five or six pros for for cocaine once a year.
__________________
#82
Riding behind enemy lines
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Occupied Texas
Posts: 408
Bikes: Orbea, Trek, Cadex, Colnago, Schwinn, Specialized, Poghliaghi, Kellog, KHS, Kellog, Litespeed
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Riis should quit his job and go dig ditches.
He's a complete embarrassment to the sport.
He's a complete embarrassment to the sport.
__________________
------------------------------------
Armstrong never got caught cheating.
That probably makes him as good a cheater as a cyclist.
-- Some guy at the Dallas Crits
------------------------------------
Armstrong never got caught cheating.
That probably makes him as good a cheater as a cyclist.
-- Some guy at the Dallas Crits
#84
Biker looking for a ride!
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Edmond Oklahoma
Posts: 1,480
Bikes: Kuota Kreedo...looking for something different.
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by iluvfreebeer
Riis should quit his job and go dig ditches.
He's a complete embarrassment to the sport.
He's a complete embarrassment to the sport.
#85
Senior Member
Originally Posted by VT Biker
This is why some of us think the best solution would be an amnesty period for past digressions, BUT, with that, the achknowledgement amongst current riders the need to submit to and implement MUCH more stringent anti-doping programs and controls.
#86
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: silicon valley
Posts: 1,774
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by rruff
I'm all for that... and at the same time I want punishments for a positive test to be much lower than they are now.
ed rader
#87
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: silicon valley
Posts: 1,774
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by iluvfreebeer
Riis should quit his job and go dig ditches.
He's a complete embarrassment to the sport.
He's a complete embarrassment to the sport.
doping is a part of this sport. the athletes that can't handle that fact find other jobs. the ones who whine about doping can't win even when they cheat.
i say put the genie back in the bottle and let theses guys do their thing. relax the testing and fewer will get busted and the problem will "go away".
no way in hell in a sport this tough you won't have cheating. better to level the playing field by letting them all do it.
and don't give me that stuff about role models with evil people like GWB and OBL on the loose .
ed rader
#88
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 4,201
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by erader
you mean like a 30-day suspension for doping? yeah, that'll do the trick .
ed rader
ed rader
__________________
#89
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: On the intramaweb thing.
Posts: 1,016
Bikes: Steel geared. Steel Fix.
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by rufvelo
AND a $500 fine
#90
No one carries the DogBoy
Originally Posted by rruff
WTF? You guys are crazy! Do you really think these gestapo tactics are the solution? Riders are coming forward and admitting... isn't this a good thing? You just want to drive it all underground again? If Riis was facing a 4 year ban he would deny forever (and so would everyone else) and nothing would ever get pinned on him.
Practically everybody was and is doping! Get with the program... don't shoot the messenger!
Practically everybody was and is doping! Get with the program... don't shoot the messenger!
#91
It is fantastic.
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: The OC
Posts: 7,977
Bikes: 05 Specialized Allez Elite; 06 Fuji Team Pro
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by DogBoy
I don't think the 4 year ban is a good idea for riders, but if the riders face the penalty, the team directors should face the SAME penalty if found to be involved in doping. Currently that is a 4 year ban from pro tour teams. I'd be all for a more reasonable approach, but I don't like to see the riders get screwed, while the team owners and directors just say "rats, they caught another rider...find a replacement and lets get on with the program."
#92
He drop me
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Central PA
Posts: 11,664
Bikes: '03 Marin Mill Valley, '02 Eddy Merckx Corsa 0.1, '12 Giant Defy Advance, '20 Giant Revolt 1, '20 Giant Defy Advanced Pro 1, some random 6KU fixie
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 138 Post(s)
Liked 12 Times
in
9 Posts
Originally Posted by Trevor98
However, he should be booted out of the sport, not as an official action of any governing body but as the intelligent move by the leadership of his team and by the sponsors. He is beyond tainted and should be alienated. He taints CSC, both the American company and the race team, with his guilt and associates both with a doper. Why would either want him around?
__________________
The views expressed by this poster do not reflect the views of BikeForums.net.
The views expressed by this poster do not reflect the views of BikeForums.net.
#95
My Name is Nobody
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Europe
Posts: 314
Bikes: Marin, Peugeot, My Grandmother's Bike
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by rruff
WTF? You guys are crazy! Do you really think these gestapo tactics are the solution? Riders are coming forward and admitting... isn't this a good thing? You just want to drive it all underground again? If Riis was facing a 4 year ban he would deny forever (and so would everyone else) and nothing would ever get pinned on him.
Practically everybody was and is doping! Get with the program... don't shoot the messenger!
Practically everybody was and is doping! Get with the program... don't shoot the messenger!
#96
pan y agua
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Jacksonville
Posts: 31,340
Bikes: Willier Zero 7; Merlin Extralight; Calfee Dragonfly tandem, Calfee Adventure tandem; Cervelo P2; Motebecane Ti Fly 29er; Motebecanne Phantom Cross; Schwinn Paramount Track bike
Mentioned: 17 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1472 Post(s)
Liked 758 Times
in
390 Posts
Originally Posted by DocRay
no, but he was famous for "developing" climbing stars like Basso and Hamilton.
wind tunnel testing.
wind tunnel testing.
and ressurecting Bobby Julich's career.
#97
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Virginia Beach
Posts: 1,038
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Grasschopper
Um I am with you on the sponsors...but who on the team is going to fire him exactly? The team is Riis Sports....he OWNS the team. https://www.team-csc.com/person_profiles.asp?p_c_id=8
#98
raodmaster shaman
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: G-ville
Posts: 1,431
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Trevor98
who would want to associate their brand name with doping? Time will tell.
#99
My Name is Nobody
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Europe
Posts: 314
Bikes: Marin, Peugeot, My Grandmother's Bike
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Trevor98
Then I wonder how he'll do without a sponsor if they pull out. He might have some difficulties with replacing CSC- who would want to associate their brand name with doping? Time will tell.
a) he has admitted taking EPO
b) he has started an independent and regular dope testing system within his team this year
If I'm a company looking to invest cheap bucks into cycling next year (rather then into NBA, duh), will I go for
Bruyneel
or will I go for
Riis ?
Francaise des Jeux or similar is not an option for me, because they never win anything !!
I choose Riis 100 times, because most of the trouble is out of his way.
One risk for Riis, a HUUUGE one: Don't have any of his top riders caught in a positive test, or other doping problem this year. Otherwise, he's gone.
For CSC Riis is now like the young talented hacker that was fooled the IT world for months, before being hired by the largest antivirus company to fight against evil. Businesswise, Riis is sitting on a huge opportunity here, but he cannot afford to fail anymore.
#100
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Virginia Beach
Posts: 1,038
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by adamastor
One risk for Riis, a HUUUGE one: Don't have any of his top riders caught in a positive test, or other doping problem this year. Otherwise, he's gone.