ericm979

Which makes you better at road races- group rides (racing type fast ones), or intervals?

botto 

depends.

ZXiMan

I vote for group rides where just about everyone is faster than you. You *will* get dropped a few times, but after awhile you'll learn to hang in, decide who's wheel to sit on and get better if you are willing to suffer. Racing or simulated racing will make you faster, period (at least in my experience).

Intervals have their place, though I haven't done any organized intervals since July. I seem to get fitter faster by mixing it up with the local fast club rides.

EDIT: I guess it does "depend" on your current level of fitness and experience. You seem to have left that out of your original post.

BigSean

Depends on what your limiters are.

MDcatV

yes.

ZXiMan

Bobby Lex

Correct.

What kind of group ride? What kind of intervals? What kind of races?

Bob

bitterken

Well, you could sort of do intervals during a group ride (depending on the ride.)

FatguyRacer

Do both.

Intervals will help you hang with those fast riders and riding with those fast riders will help your racecraft.

umd

I think both have their place. For those starting out, I would say favor fast/hard group rides more than intervals. For those more experienced, I think it would depend on your training goals.

jonestr

I would go with intervals as you are not looking to hold anything back so they will increase your fitness, but group rides will teach you how to conserve your energy like you would actually do in a race.

Cheap answer

you will eventually need both

Duke of Kent

Intervals to the group ride, group ride, intervals home from the group ride.

jonestr

If you can do that then your intervals are not hard enough

San Rensho 

I guess if I could only do one, it would be group rides. If the group is good, then you will be doing intervals as soon as someone pushes the pace and it strings out single file. Or you can go to the front (or hang off the back) and it will be like doing intervals.

The added advantage of the group is that you are going FAST, at or near race pace, so you are doing essentially intervals and motorpacing at the same time.

In my old age, I just can't get myself to look at a watch and push myself to the point of pain. But if I'm in a group and I know if I don't bridge this gap up ahaed I will get dropped, I can push myself very hard.

Duke of Kent

hahahahahahaha.

carpediemracing 

+1 on all points.

Racing penalizes you for being too exuberant, but it's otherwise a group ride.

I can't push myself nearly as hard on my own than I can when in a group situation. I found it hard to push really hard after 12-13 years of racing. Now I try to race or do group rides to push myself. More fun and much easier mentally. The only other way I can push is if I go and find a "so slow you fall over" hill, and the whole concept of falling over if I don't keep going motivates me pretty well.

The motorpacing bit in group rides is important too. Chasing trucks and such is an alternative, but they rarely cooperate for more than a couple miles at a time.

I think the best training would be to do group rides or races, with one or two easy solo rides a week to R&R. I had my best seasons when I did that.

cdr

ericm979

I did a lot of that this year. Well, intervals before the ride anyhow. That particular twice-weekly group ride is small (why I like it) and has a couple good climbs and sprints. On any given day there's almost always at least one rider faster than me on the climbs and the sprints, and usually there's more who are faster.

My plan for the year had more of the large fast weekend group rides but I wound up not doing many of them and doing more long endurance paced climbing rides instead, because I like those better. But that's not good training for racing, especially large pack racecraft (good word!), which I am lacking.


I asked because I am thinking about my goals and plan for next year. It seems like a lot of posters here and on the wattage list favor lots of solo intervals or even trainer work (yuck!) to get their training just right. I find intervals to be difficult mentally. This is the first year since like 1990 that I have been able to do them consistently.

badfishgood

You can cheat during groups rides... Sit in and suck wheels. Unless there are climbs...

On a fast flat ride I'll most definitely take pulls up front. So in essence, it becomes interval training. I hate intervals.

VosBike

There are still plenty of people (me included, but real fast guys also) who train old school: Go fast in groups alot, Go fast with training buddies when there's no group ride, and do only real recovery rides alone.

There are hard-to-replicate micro-efforts that tax you more for a given avg. (or norm.) power output that you do while riding in a group. While your legs can adjust to this in a few weeks before racing starts, I find it much easier to just be training in fast groups all year round.

mollusk

Adding a motorcycle to the front of a fast group ride when you are at the back of a 20+ person single file is the total suck.

And I mean that in the best way possible.

rizz

Intervals while doing the group ride. Piss off your pace line by doing 15/15 sprints.

nitropowered

Ride the group ride to warm up (do no work and sit in the back) then go hammer 1hr of intervals.

JPradun

I like just doing my intervals during the saturday (30+ rider) group ride. It turns into a hammerfest after 20min for a few minute surges at a time, then slows down so some people can talk a little bit.

So, I'll get to the front on a long road and hammer it until I nearly blow up...usually about 3-5min. String it out to 30+mph and sit up. Usually the whole group slows down because no one wants to pull after that, which will give you time to recover. Just make sure you can still hang on if they DO continue to pull. As soon as you recover, repeat. Limit it, though, and don't be an ass about it.

If you're strong enough to hang on with no problem and even do a couple pulls, then it's time to start doing specific interval work by yourself. If you can barely hang or you are getting dropped, keep working with the group riding.

VosBike

Having the benefit of a euro-pro ridden group ride twice a week just makes this discussion null for me. Guess if I was the fast guy in town, then I would feel more need for itntervals.

caloso

My group rides are intervals.