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El Diablo Rojo 05-25-09 04:56 PM


Originally Posted by kimconyc (Post 8980572)
No, Levi--as leader--should not have gotten dropped. I'm really disappointed. I thought Levi had the killer instinct. Maybe the crash really did hurt him more than it appears.

It's crazy how Popo broke down too. WTF was the point of that breakaway without any legitimate result? He basically just wasted enough energy where the rest day probably won't do crap for him and the whole Astana team might simply get dropped on the way up Blockhaus.

I just don't get it...

The point of putting Popo up the road was to have him fall back to help Levi when Levi and company started their move....the problem was that there was an 'and company' but no Levi...at the point that Levi started to falter Popo should have fallen back to lend a hand...he was 9min down for gods sake what good would it have done the overall even if he had won? Well it's pretty much over for Levi now...he's not going to even get onto the podium, the fight is between Basso and Sastre for third and Menchov and DiLuca for the top step. Rabobank has ridden very very well as a team, much better than I would have expected and Menchov is riding at what may be his best form of his career. Wed is going to be epic.

obie 05-25-09 04:58 PM

Old Giro update:


'DZ Lips'

http://www.livestrong.com/lance-arms...-ebbfe0b03389/

patentcad 05-25-09 04:59 PM

If Lance can't get a corporate sponsor like Nike or Novartis to step up and make a multiyear $50-$100 million commitment to the defunct Astana squad, they will fold. But I don't think that will happen since they are arguably the strongest cycling team in the UCI and they have the biggest marquee star power, particularly if Lance agrees to ride in 2010 too.

Stay tuned.

YMCA 05-25-09 05:20 PM

Why are so many people counting Levi and others out?
There are still two mountain top finishes and a 15k TT.

Yes, DiLuca and Menchov look awesome, but bad days can hit quick.

obie 05-25-09 05:28 PM


Originally Posted by YMCA (Post 8981907)
Yes, DiLuca and Menchov look awesome, but bad days can hit quick.


Checking the diff. twitters: today's stage length, climbs (17,000') and the high 90's temps, make this one of harshest stages these guys can remember (ck.Lance & Levi's comments).

Some guys may have left their best on the road today and will be looking for a pull to Rome from their teams.

erader 05-25-09 06:27 PM


Originally Posted by El Diablo Rojo (Post 8981679)
Oh you mean being wrong about Menchov...or being wrong about Levi....cause if we go back and look I think we'll find that you are one who said Menchov and Sastre didn't rate and that Levi was a contender....

Levi is a contender. i said i didn't like menchov and that he has a lot to prove. i said yesterday that he's the guy to beat. i don't think i ever said anything negative about sastre but you go ahead and look it up... since you want to be right and argue.... hell you just might be right :eek:?

yeah i like levi, so what? who are you pulling for this race besides anyone but levi or are you still hedging :D? are you saying the bolshevik has it in the bag?

ed rader

erader 05-25-09 06:34 PM


Originally Posted by USAZorro (Post 8981669)
I'll start.

Who here feels certain that Menchov is Rabobank's GC rider for the Tour? I think that Gesink will make a lot of noise, and if Dennis finds the 2nd consecutive GT too much, he'll become team leader with a legitimate shot at the podium...

full disclosure - I was too busy being a runner in my youth to take cycling seriously - a bit to my regret now. I have a grand total of zero official races under my belt. This automatically makes me a complete ignoramous. :rolleyes:

if he wins the giro i think he better be rabo's man for the tour.

ed rader

El Diablo Rojo 05-25-09 07:22 PM


Originally Posted by erader (Post 8982257)
Levi is a contender. i said i didn't like menchov and that he has a lot to prove. i said yesterday that he's the guy to beat. i don't think i ever said anything negative about sastre but you go ahead and look it up... since you want to be right and argue.... hell you just might be right :eek:?

yeah i like levi, so what? who are you pulling for this race besides anyone but levi or are you still hedging :D? are you saying the bolshevik has it in the bag?

ed rader

I'm pulling for Basso..he's in with a shout for the last step but that's about as far as he could get.

Look Ed you flatly stated that winning the Vuelta was meaningless. You dismissed the Vuelta and those who have won it (Sastre/Menchov) because guys like Lance didn't race it. You stated that Menchov isn't a contender that he would find a way to lose. Yet you still say that Levi is a contender even though Menchov is eating his lunch...Levi has never won a three week stage race. His biggest stage race win is the ToC. A race that 95% of the peloton treats as a training race and Levi treats as his TdF. As I've said in previous responses you can't rate Levi on one hand and dismiss guys who have won Grand Tours with other. I said from the beginning that Levi wouldn't make the podium and I'm sticking by that statement. Unless he produces a 'supernatural' performance on Wed he's done. And yes Ed I'm arguing because I am right..

bbattle 05-25-09 07:23 PM


Originally Posted by kimconyc (Post 8980192)
That's why I'd be pissed. If you read my previous comments, to me, it was clear Levi was the leader up until now. But the point is that it's questionable now, to me at least, whether he deserved that leadership role in the first place. 4th place, or 6th as it currently stands for Levi, doesn't mean much.

http://i44.tinypic.com/2i6gwb8.jpg

If Lance had not broken his collarbone, his training would've moved him up a couple of notches(IMO) and he could've been the go to gc rider. But Levi was ready, willing and able but Menchov, DiLuca and company are just too strong right now. But these guys are no slouches and it's no crime to lose to them. It's about time Menchov lived up to his promise.

Yes, it's disappointing to me too that Levi can't or won't attack like DiLuca or Basso or Sastre but he's a damn good rider and would be number one on a half dozen other pro teams.

I really hope Astana runs a multi attack scheme like CSC did last year.

El Diablo Rojo 05-25-09 07:25 PM


Originally Posted by bbattle (Post 8982599)
If Lance had not broken his collarbone, his training would've moved him up a couple of notches(IMO) and he could've been the go to gc rider. But Levi was ready, willing and able but Menchov, DiLuca and company are just too strong right now. But these guys are no slouches and it's no crime to lose to them. It's about time Menchov lived up to his promise.

Yes, it's disappointing to me too that Levi can't or won't attack like DiLuca or Basso or Sastre but he's a damn good rider and would be number one on a half dozen other pro teams.

I really hope Astana runs a multi attack scheme like CSC did last year.

Chris Horner broke his collarbone right around the same time LA broke his...he showed up and rocked this race...

bbattle 05-25-09 07:25 PM


Originally Posted by USAZorro (Post 8980275)
You haven't been watching much have you? Lance has been pulling Levi along several times during the 2nd week. Yesterday, he pulled Popo and Cunego the last 20K.

Agreed. Lance has been "Mr. Domestique" all season.

bbattle 05-25-09 07:32 PM


Originally Posted by kimconyc (Post 8980572)
No, Levi--as leader--should not have gotten dropped. I'm really disappointed. I thought Levi had the killer instinct. Maybe the crash really did hurt him more than it appears.

It's crazy how Popo broke down too. WTF was the point of that breakaway without any legitimate result? He basically just wasted enough energy where the rest day probably won't do crap for him and the whole Astana team might simply get dropped on the way up Blockhaus.

I just don't get it...

Popovych and Cunego(and Scarponi and Bosisio) broke down because they went on crazy attacks and a long breakaway in stifling heat and humidity. They thought they could do it and Popo came real close but in the end, it was like so many other breakaways, it failed.

What happened today to Levi could very well happen to any of the other gc riders. Everybody has a bad day in a grand stage race; the trick to winning gc is to have your bad day on the same day as the other gc riders.

After all the attacks and counterattacks, when are Menchov, DiLuca, Sastre, Basso going to have a bad day? Better not be on Blockhaus.

qmsdc15 05-25-09 07:32 PM


Originally Posted by El Diablo Rojo (Post 8982616)
Chris Horner broke his collarbone right around the same time LA broke his...he showed up and rocked this race...

Didn't he pull out with a sore leg muscle?

bbattle 05-25-09 07:38 PM


Originally Posted by patentcad (Post 8981778)
If Lance can't get a corporate sponsor like Nike or Novartis to step up and make a multiyear $50-$100 million commitment to the defunct Astana squad, they will fold. But I don't think that will happen since they are arguably the strongest cycling team in the UCI and they have the biggest marquee star power, particularly if Lance agrees to ride in 2010 too.

Stay tuned.

I think Lance could get corporate sponsorship tomorrow if he wanted/needed it.

Or, he could send out a twitter for cash; it'd have to be for a new venture, not his cancer foundation, and the money would roll in by the barrel.

I'd love to see team "Chico's Bail Bonds" riding in the Tour. That would be totally badass.

El Diablo Rojo 05-25-09 07:38 PM


Originally Posted by qmsdc15 (Post 8982666)
Didn't he pull out with a sore leg muscle?

Crash

http://www.velonews.com/article/92237

kimconyc 05-25-09 07:38 PM


Originally Posted by bbattle (Post 8982599)
If Lance had not broken his collarbone, his training would've moved him up a couple of notches(IMO) and he could've been the go to gc rider. But Levi was ready, willing and able but Menchov, DiLuca and company are just too strong right now. But these guys are no slouches and it's no crime to lose to them. It's about time Menchov lived up to his promise.

Yes, it's disappointing to me too that Levi can't or won't attack like DiLuca or Basso or Sastre but he's a damn good rider and would be number one on a half dozen other pro teams.

I really hope Astana runs a multi attack scheme like CSC did last year.

I think they tried that today; worked out really well :innocent:

On another note, anyone really impressed by Ivan Basso and Liquigas, the team? Basso's really impressed me considering he hasn't raced for a while...

kimconyc 05-25-09 07:41 PM


Originally Posted by bbattle (Post 8982665)
Popovych and Cunego(and Scarponi and Bosisio) broke down because they went on crazy attacks and a long breakaway in stifling heat and humidity. They thought they could do it and Popo came real close but in the end, it was like so many other breakaways, it failed.

What happened today to Levi could very well happen to any of the other gc riders. Everybody has a bad day in a grand stage race; the trick to winning gc is to have your bad day on the same day as the other gc riders.

After all the attacks and counterattacks, when are Menchov, DiLuca, Sastre, Basso going to have a bad day? Better not be on Blockhaus.

I'm betting that they have theirs' tomorrow, while having coffee and pastries (you can substitute this for EPO if you wish). :innocent:

Laggard 05-25-09 07:44 PM


Originally Posted by El Diablo Rojo (Post 8982591)
Look Ed you flatly stated that winning the Vuelta was meaningless. You dismissed the Vuelta and those who have won it (Sastre/Menchov) because guys like Lance didn't race it. You stated that Menchov isn't a contender that he would find a way to lose. Yet you still say that Levi is a contender even though Menchov is eating his lunch...Levi has never won a three week stage race. His biggest stage race win is the ToC. A race that 95% of the peloton treats as a training race and Levi treats as his TdF. As I've said in previous responses you can't rate Levi on one hand and dismiss guys who have won Grand Tours with other. I said from the beginning that Levi wouldn't make the podium and I'm sticking by that statement. Unless he produces a 'supernatural' performance on Wed he's done. And yes Ed I'm arguing because I am right..

+1

Sadly the 99ers treat any race that Mr. Armstrong did not compete in as an unimportant easy race.

bbattle 05-25-09 07:47 PM

I'm thinking more of the strategy of forcing Cadel Evans to watch Andy and Frank Schleck as well as Sastre. Either one of the three could've attacked seriously on Alpe D'Huez but it was Sastre who did and Cadel simply couldn't chase after covering the Schleck brothers mini attacks.

Levi will get a chance to rest, too.

In the Tour, Astana will bring Popovych, Lance, Levi, Contador, Kloden, Brakjovic, Horner?, Rubiero, and some Kazakh rider. Get somebody in Maillot Jaune and it's game over.

acortez 05-25-09 07:59 PM

Is anyone missing that Levi had a puncture right before the last climb. I think that had something to do with his collapse. He was probably panicking knowing that the attacks were going to come soon and he was waiting for the SAG. Some may say he cracked but that was a tough position for him to be in.

El Diablo Rojo 05-25-09 08:04 PM


Originally Posted by acortez (Post 8982842)
Is anyone missing that Levi had a puncture right before the last climb. I think that had something to do with his collapse. He was probably panicking knowing that the attacks were going to come soon and he was waiting for the SAG. Some may say he cracked but that was a tough position for him to be in.

He flatted on the descent and was well back on long before the climb.

kimconyc 05-25-09 08:06 PM


Originally Posted by acortez (Post 8982842)
Is anyone missing that Levi had a puncture right before the last climb. I think that had something to do with his collapse. He was probably panicking knowing that the attacks were going to come soon and he was waiting for the SAG. Some may say he cracked but that was a tough position for him to be in.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRxGNttpaZA :thumb:

acortez 05-25-09 08:10 PM


Originally Posted by kimconyc (Post 8982897)

Experience may have something to do with that. Never being the "man" may have played a role in recovering in a big moment.

TheKillerPenguin 05-25-09 08:10 PM

I missed the video, but chasing back on like that before a monster climb can really mess with your mojo. Still, 3 minutes is 3 minutes.

Racer Ex 05-25-09 08:28 PM

His twitter account went down. Someone in front of him farted. He wore the wrong socks. Quit with the lame excuses. He cracked like Marion Barry in a cheap DC hotel room with a skank. That's it. End of story. Quit trying to make yourself feel good about your mancrush.


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